# Episode 4 - Man vs Bear

- Podcast: GenX Adulting Podcast
- Published: 2024-08-28T21:00:00.000Z
- Audio: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2398379/episodes/15645586-episode-4-man-vs-bear.mp3
- Page: https://genxadultingpodcast.com/transcripts/podcasts/genx-adulting-podcast/episodes/episode-4
- Source: https://genxadultingpodcast.com/episodes/genxadultingpodcastepisode4.html
- People: Brian Barker (host), Nicole Barker (host)

## Summary

In Episode 4 of Gen X Adulting, the hosts discuss the controversial topic of choosing between a man or a bear in a hypothetical scenario involving their daughter. The conversation delves into themes of safety, trust, and the dynamics of male-female relationships, highlighting women's fears regarding men compared to the perceived dangers of wild animals.

## Key takeaways

- Many women feel safer facing a bear than a man due to the unpredictability of male behavior.
- Safety concerns for women often stem from societal issues and personal experiences with men.
- The conversation emphasizes the importance of teaching boys to respect women and understand consent.
- Women often have to maintain a heightened sense of awareness regarding their safety in public spaces.
- The dynamics of male aggression towards women are discussed as a power play rather than purely sexual.
- The episode highlights the need for women to support each other against societal pressures and male aggression.

## FAQ

### Why would someone choose a bear over a man in a safety scenario?

Many women feel that a bear, while dangerous, is less likely to inflict psychological harm compared to a man, who may pose a threat of assault or abuse.

### What factors contribute to women's fear of men?

Women's fears often arise from societal dynamics, personal experiences, and the understanding that men can be unpredictable and aggressive.

### How can parents teach boys to respect women?

Parents should engage in open conversations about consent, respect, and the importance of treating women as equals from a young age.

### What is the significance of the bear vs. man debate?

The debate highlights the stark differences in how men and women perceive safety and threat, revealing deeper societal issues regarding gender dynamics.

### How do societal views on women affect their safety?

Societal views often lead to victim-blaming and a lack of accountability for male perpetrators, which contributes to women's fears and the need for constant vigilance.


## Referenced links

- [Watch on YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gF_OVSj_vAg)
- [Listen on Apple Podcasts](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/episode-4-man-vs-bear/id1764838823?i=1000666950272)
- [Listen on Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/episode/6IzwWthWuOGB8eK7y8dQK6)
- [Listen on Buzzsprout](https://www.buzzsprout.com/2398379/episodes/15645586-episode-4-man-vs-bear)

## Transcript

[Music]
Welcome to Episode 4 of Gen X Adulting.
Today we are going to
discuss Man versus Bear.
Yes, so I recently made a post on TikTok
where I asked you if you had to leave
Kaya alone, our daughter, in the woods
with either a man or a bear.
Which would you choose
and what did you choose?
I chose the bear.
You chose the bear. Now,
why did you choose the bear?
I chose the bear because I couldn't know
who the man would be
in the woods with her.
So I trust her ability to deal with the
bear, whether it's to escape
and hide or whatever, right?
Deal with the bear versus
dealing with a strange guy.
Okay, and then I asked you if it was
between a bear and a
woman, what would you choose?
A woman, yeah, no doubt.
And why did you choose a woman?
They could work together
and figure out the bear.
Okay, so how much did safety come into
play in your decision making?
How much did safety for Kaya or for if
it's any woman, but for Kaya for you
personally, your daughter, in your
decision making, how much did her safety
come into play in your decision making?
Well, probably 100%.
But it's also a, it's
an interesting challenge.
There's not, you don't feel like you have
a lot of time to maybe process it, in a
sense, right? You're
looking for an answer.
So it's pretty snap judgment, I guess, an
instinctual response.
Right.
So what would make you feel
that she is safer with a bear?
How is a man a threat to women?
Men can be real dickheads, you know, real
assholes, unsafe, you know, especially in
the dynamics with a woman.
And she's an attractive girl.
So that, you know, I don't know if that
changes it a ton, but in my mind, it
feels like it could or should.
It's really interesting because that you
say that because I think all
women feel unsafe around men.
And I think attraction
is obviously subjective.
It's attractive, not that you know, you
might find certain women attractive that
other men don't and and
everyone has their own tastes.
Right. And then everyone thinks their
children are beautiful.
So that goes without
saying so the attractive part.
Sometimes I wonder, are men attracted to
women when they're
looking at them as prey?
I think they're looking at them
differently than you would look at a
woman as far as is she attractive or not?
I think the way a man looks when a man is
looking at a woman as prey does
attraction come into play or
is it more a power struggle?
Everything I've say not researched would
be the wrong word, but
it's more of a power play.
I think we're talking about men who are
probably men who prey
on women are weak men.
Right. So you're right. The attraction
plays is not in play as much per se, as
much as there may be.
When I say her being attractive, I think
she's physically attractive, but she's
also funny and smart and
in witty and in all of that.
Right. So I think but she's also pretty
strong, strong minded girl.
I think when it comes to guys that prey
on women, they're probably looking for
someone they could exploit or maybe that
they wouldn't think is a strong or,
you know, it's really it's a really
fucked up thing, quite honestly. So
someone that they can overpower.
Yeah. So the men who and when you think
of men who prey on women and it's
interesting because I think a significant
amount of men would assault a woman if
they knew that they
would never get caught.
And obviously, it's a pretty big
statement. I do really think that's true.
I think there's a significant amount of
men that would assault a woman and a
significant amount of boys that would
assault a girl if they thought they could
get sexually assault.
Yes, not just punch them. Yes. Yeah.
Interesting. I think in general, most
assault is sexual from man to woman.
Obviously, there's men who beat their
partners or there was that guy that was
going around New York recently punching
women, women randomly.
That's not what I'm talking about.
I don't dispute what you're saying. And
that's probably why instinctually I'm
saying I'd rather have her take her
chances with a bear because the bear is,
you know, obviously
physically stronger than any guy.
They're faster than any guy in climate
tree. It's hard to escape a bear. If a
bear wants to get you a
bear's probably going to do it.
But the dynamics of the bear is they're
most aggressive when they're protecting
the young. So when you ask me this
question, I sound it's going off.
Yes. You asked me this question. That's
all part of it is figuring out what's the
what's going on with the bear.
So what's interesting is just to name a
few things a bear would not do. A bear
would not hide you in their
basement for weeks on end.
A bear would not torture you for their
own pleasure. A bear would not rape a
woman. A bear would.
There's so many things that a man that
men do to women and speakable things that
a bear would never do.
So I think with this TikTok phenomenon
that's going on as far as bear versus
man, there's a group of men
that seem to be about hurt over.
Yeah, the comments. Some of those
comments were pretty comical.
So some men I think are taking this
personally. And I find it interesting
because they're viewing it as and maybe
this is how men
automatically go to think.
Who would you win? And who would you beat
in a fight or who could you kill the bear
or the man? Yeah. But women
aren't thinking like that.
Women are assuming I'm going to die with
both of these creatures. They are putting
the chance of death at higher, actually,
but at least at the same level of being
killed by a man is
being killed by a bear.
But I think they think their chances are
better of distracting a bear or getting
away from a bear. Whereas with a man that
the chances of getting away from a man
are going to be much more challenging.
And I think that these men are really
shocked that women are picking the bear.
And they're not understanding that women
are terrified of men.
And more than anything, probably more
than if you if you made all the men stay
home for 48 hours, women could walk
around at night alone without worrying
about one single thing in their lives.
Women could go on a run at 10 p.m. at
night anywhere in the world. If you made
all the men stay home, women could go
anywhere they want in the world alone.
And this is not something that men, I
think, understand, that every day of our
lives, we have to take certain things
into consideration that
never crosses a man's mind.
But if those men stayed home and didn't
leave for a certain amount of time, we
would be more free and not have that
stress. So that's where that's coming
from, is that the concern about being
hurt by a man is already there.
And we're so used to it. And we know the
chance of what they can do. So if you put
a man in front of us and then put a bear
in front of us, we already
know what the man's going to do.
Yeah, the man's a known entity. The bear
is an unknown. You think you could
probably deal with it.
Yeah. Yeah. You got a shot.
So, yeah, the man is a known entity and
we think we have better chances with a
bear. But here's another twist.
When I first asked you, you actually said
a man, obviously. And then you said,
because we would know who the man is,
right? And I said, no,
it would be a random man.
And then you said, well, the bear. But
what's interesting about you picking a
man that we would know is many girls and
women are abused, I think, more by men
that they know than they don't.
Well, that was a lot of the commentary,
right, around on the TikTok was it's not
the men you don't know. It's the men that
you do know. Right. Yeah.
And so it's just men across the board,
whether you know them or not. I think you
and I were talking about it this morning
and I think I counted seven
men I would trust 100 percent.
That's nothing compared to all the men I
know. So and there's none of those other
men have done anything, but it's just you
don't know. You just don't know.
And so it's just, it's just a lot of
people that you hear about that molest
children and their
rape girls and rape women.
Some of it's shocking of who does these
things. Yeah. So so it creates this
distrust. And I think on another note,
another way of looking at this is when
someone's attacked by a bear
and let's say they're killed.
That usually makes the news somewhere,
even if it's the local news, right?
People are just. Yeah. Statistically,
bears are not killing people. Right.
Yeah. And usually the bears
hunted down and killed. Yep.
When men assault women, it typically
doesn't make the news for how I think
it's like over 400,000 women are
assaulted a year. We're not seeing over
400,000 news segments
about women getting assaulted.
And those men are not being hunted down
and killed. In fact, typically those men
are not even getting jail
time or if they do, it's a joke.
So I think that goes into this whole
conversation of not only do women not
trust men, but society doesn't. It's a
man's world. It's a man's world. Society
does not take it seriously.
I've always joked it's good to be a guy.
I know. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I mean,
listen, I love being a woman and there's
so many amazing things about
girlhood and I wouldn't trade.
But when it comes to safety, yes, it's
good to be a guy. There is no question
about it. And typically guys have each
other's backs, but no one's saying to the
bear. Well, what were you wearing the
bears friends and colleagues aren't
coming forward saying, you know, I don't
think the bear could have killed that.
You know, I've never, he's never talked
about wanting to kill before. I've never
known him to kill him. You know, there's
that what did you know, what did you do
to entice the bear to kill you? So it all
goes into play, right? Women have been
quite, were you drinking too much before
the bear killed you?
So it's always doing that. Who is asking
those questions? Both men and women. Yes.
Do it. Yes. Yeah. Men
and women definitely do it.
There's a conspiracy from both sides for
both men and women against women. Yes.
It's not just like this. It's a men
against women type of thing. Women are
not always their best
advocates as a whole, if you will.
Yes, I agree. I think when it comes to
something like a victim coming forward
about sexual assault, typically it's more
men that are questioning her, the victim
blaming than women. But there are
definitely women that are out there
sniping against these victims as well.
I always go back to Hillary Clinton,
right? And for me, and it's really just
an age thing when Bill was taking
advantage of her. What's the right word?
Exploiting Monica Lewinsky. Yes. Yes.
Back in the day, the news was Hillary
attacking Monica instead of going after
her own husband. Yes. Completely
exploited an 18 or 19 year
old intern, whatever she was.
Completely took advantage of her. This
bitch is out there going after her as the
victim. And I can tell you from me
personally, I think it was, I don't know,
18, 19, 20 years old. I was like, this
woman, powerful woman is creating fear
and doubt, creating uncertainty. Right.
And it's like, it's kind of wild. Yeah.
It gets you thinking. Okay. So what, and
that's the danger in all of that, right?
That piece of shit goes after Monica in
defense of her power. Not even her
husband, that's her power, right?
That sets the tone for a lot of people to
now to doubt the story. It's a
fascinating dynamic. I'm not saying she
was the first. She was the first for me
because of the age and timing of me
actually paying attention to the news and
seeing what's going on there.
But it's a playbook. It's a playbook that
happens every day, all day. And it's done
by both men and women against
the victim, whoever they are.
I agree. 100%. I think when it comes to
Hillary, I think a lot of Gen Xers with
can vividly remember what you're talking
about. And I think for Hillary Clinton,
it was self-serving. Of course. Yeah. Of
course. And I think in a lot of
situations, I mean, you have defense
attorneys who are women. So they're going
to, I don't know how they live with
themselves, but they're going to go after
the women, the victim who are women.
They're going to go
after them in that way.
Well, think about that, right? Think
about that. How you live with yourself.
You can talk yourself into most things.
Yeah. So even if you are a victim, if
you're surrounded by enough fucked up
people, you might actually believe that
maybe I did drink too much. Or maybe my
clothing was too provocative. Or maybe I
shouldn't have done something. That's
just not the case. Right. Right. I mean.
Well, I think we've come a long way. I
mean, I think in general, there's less
and less victim blaming, but it's still
there. I mean, even if you look at
headlines about, you know, women attacked
while jogging instead of man attacked
woman while she was jogging.
Well, remember this, this was, what was
it in Memphis, I think the woman, the
lady went out for a jog.
Yes. This is the worst one.
The thing up in Athens, Georgia, I think
it was recently, right? The college girl
was out running illegal alien from
Venezuela, I think kills her. One of
those papers, honestly, I think it was
one of the liberal newspapers, maybe New
York times. I think it was that sometimes
writer said, just a reminder that women
shouldn't go out
running in the morning. Right.
That fucked up as that. Right. That
drives me crazy. Yes. Now. And again,
that is victim blaming. Yeah. It is 100%.
Women should be allowed to go on a run.
I'm going to be very clear. Women should
be allowed to go on a run any hour of the
day or night whenever they want. It's
just not reality. I know, but they
should. Women should be able to go out
and run. And it doesn't matter what they
have on. It does not. None of it matters.
They should 100% and
have every right to go out.
Anybody should. It's not even a man
versus woman thing. It's a crime thing,
but no, but we're talking about women. So
when this happens to young, to women
where they get attacked at four in the
morning or at whatever time, six in the
evening, it has nothing to do with what
they were doing is 100. It is 100% on the
attacker. The psychopath who raped and
murdered these women.
That is who it's on.
It doesn't has nothing to do with the
woman. So as far as these headlines, it
should always state who the man was who
did this crime. That's that's doesn't
happen. I know. And that's part of the
US. So what's where? What's the problem?
That's part of the problem. That's part
of society. The bigger problem is those
these are not punishable crimes. They
should be, but they're not. And if you
were to get convicted, my gosh, how long
the trial would it would it
be? It's not like it's not.
It's not like it's quick. Right. Right.
So it takes a while. You get plenty of
appeals to get public defenders,
whatever, even if you get off on a
technicality. But if you actually did get
convicted, and I'm not, I don't know
this, or I'm talking out of my rear on
this in some ways, but I don't think the
time ever fits the crime in that sense.
I agree.
I think it should be any all I don't
think any any crimes or any time fits
most crimes, I guess.
Well, at least when it comes to sexual
assault on women. So I think you go
through, and this has been going on for
hundreds of years against women. It's
really just in the last century that
finally women are starting to get some
vindication. But it's
almost ingrained in us.
I mean, Kaya, I've raised her to always
be on the lookout and always be prepared
since she was little. And even now, when
she's in the parking lot, and when she
goes here and goes there, she knows she's
always on alert, always on alert.
So I think when you ask a woman that
question, if you were alone in the woods,
and you came across a man in the woods,
and you're looking at that man, and he's
looking at you, and you were in the
woods, and you came across a bear.
And he's not even looking at you, or even
if he does, who are you going to pick?
You're going to pick the bear. You really
think so? Yes. 100%. Why? If I came
across a man in the woods.
Yeah, but the bear, the bear is going to
scare the shit out of you, right? It's
going to scare most people. I'm scared of
the bulls are scared. Yeah, but if
there's a bear, you're like, oh my god,
there's a bear, and there's a dude over
there. You might go, you wouldn't think
to go to the, in, say, hey, can you help?
No, no, no, it's one or the other.
What do you mean? That's what makes it.
No, who would you rather run into in the
woods? Okay, so I run into a man, and he
he's looking at me. Okay. So would the
bear scare the shit out of me? Yes. The
point is, they both scare the shit out of
me. Yeah. But which one am I going to
have a chance with? Yeah. And also, if
they're both going to kill me, at least
with the bear, he's going to maul me. He's going to kill me.
He's going to maul me. He's going to bite
me. I'm going to bleed to death. It's
done with the man. He's going to torture
me. He's going to rape me. He's going to
dismember me. You know, who knows what
he's going to do to me before he finally
kills me. So that is what women are
thinking of. That is the might. And you
are getting into the mind of a woman.
That's what goes through our minds.
Terrible. Is what could these men do?
That's what it is. That's terrible. So
take that into just
being out. These girls are
women at bars or restaurants and always
wondering. Yeah. I mean, that's why you
guys have to travel in a squad or in a
pack. Yes. To your point, you got to look
over your shoulder. It's crazy. Now with
these apple air tags, people are putting
air tags in cars and bags and whatever.
Yeah. Following people home. It's
completely crazy. And you know how easy
it is for men to put something in a
women's drink. It's so
easy. So you're always on guard.
You have to watch your purse so they
don't drop an air tank and you have to
watch your drink so they don't drug you.
You have to make sure you can get to your
car. Okay. You have to kind of look as
you're walking up to your guy as you're
walking up to your car.
You're looking under your car as you're
walking up to make sure no one's under
your car. If there's something on your
car, you drive home with it on your car
because you don't want to touch it. These
are just things naturally going through
our heads at all times.
Don't even get me started on the men that
follow women and girls around stores.
I will say this just to like, if I'm
getting gas at the gas station, I don't,
I'm looking over my shoulder and stuff.
Yes. You know, so if there is a
situational awareness, I'm not as afraid
as any woman because
I'm a, I'm, I am a guy.
I'm, I feel like I can at least take care
of myself for the first round or two.
Right. You know, um, I would advocate
women do concealed carry. I really truly
was. I think every woman should carry a
gun. Go learn how to shoot, how to handle
a gun and carry a gun in your purse or
your belt or whatever. That's crazy.
But that is the world we live in and
that's crazy. And men do it too. If you
come to South Florida, assume everyone's
carrying a gun and it helps keep the
peace quite frankly.
To some degree.
To some degree, but, um,
yeah, no, it's interesting.
But even, okay. So, but for you, when
you're at a gas station, you're more
focused on crime, you're not focused on
that. Somebody is going to kidnap you or
assault you. You're focused on is
somebody going to try to steal your car
or steal your money.
No, I'm, I'm thinking, yeah, yeah. But
I'm, but how they get you, how might, how
they get my car or money goes through an
assault, whether it's, you know, so if
I'm saying there, I'm like,
you know, I am looking around and making
sure that there's no one coming up behind
me or approaching. If someone pulls up on
a strange vehicle that with tinted
windows, let's say, and, um, you know,
that's reason for or
cause or caution, caution.
I was going to say pause. That's kind of
a moment for pause and think about it.
Right. So there's a constant situational
awareness. Even not even just getting
gas. Hell, go into
like, um, home depot work.
Or, or a retail store at eight o'clock at
night when it's dark. Yes. It's just the,
it's just the world we live
in, in most metropolitan areas.
So I think, yes, for both of us that were
aware of our surroundings when we're out
and about, I think for me as a woman,
it's on a totally different level, 100%.
So what's interesting is, or what I'd
like to ask you is growing
up as a boy and as a man.
There's a reason you said the bear. And I
would assert that the reason you chose
the bear and the reason that other
fathers would choose the bear is because
men know men. So growing up in the locker
room or with your friends or being around
guys or being around men.
Are there, are there outward, obvious
situations where, are there situations
where it's obvious how men feel about
women when it comes to how
they view them as far as?
Well, it's in a derogatory way.
But I think this is where that it gets a
little convoluted because as boys and
men, you're chasing girls, right?
Heterosexual speaking, right? So you're
interested in girls for the attraction,
you know, eventually, you know, probably
starts out kissing or whatever, right?
You're trying to get laid. Let's, let's
put it that way. You're trying to get
laid. But this isn't that what you're
describing is more of the power play.
Right.
That's not the healthy birds and the bees
or the courting of someone you're
attracted to and there's a mutual
attraction and that kind of thing, right?
That's more say give and
take. That's a relationship.
What you're describing is a power play
and that's not something I think is very
pervasive. It's not like you're sitting
in the locker room and you're like, oh
yeah, so and so likes to rape girls.
None. That's not found to be an
acceptable thing, right? That's a closet
thing. And it's a honestly, I think
that's a secret in many ways, right? If
someone's out running
around, I don't think men,
you can look at somebody and come up with
a stereotype on somebody, right? Whatever
it might be. Oh, that guy's a, he's a
metalhead, a deadhead or, or whatever.
Frat boy.
Frat boy. All that kind of stuff. You
can't look at something like, oh, that
guy's a rapist or that guy's a, an abuser
or it's just not how it works.
But do you think that, so then what about
the date rape culture where let's say on
a college situation in, in fraternities
or at college parties or high school
parties, would you think that at least
more than one boy or man is aware that
date rape drugs are being
used in those situations?
And if so, then there is kind of this
silent agreement that,
okay, this is what we're doing.
I honestly don't know. I can't relate to
that. It's not, no, I don't know.
So you never in all your years through
high school, college, as an athlete,
everything up until we got married, never
ever came across a situation where anyone
was talking about, or you heard of anyone
drugging a girl to rape her or that
someone had raped a girl or taken
advantage of a girl or assaulted a girl.
Not at all. No, not like an
intentional. Let's no, no.
And you never heard of
anyone assaulting a girl.
I think there's, I'm aware of
questionable things, right? Whether it's
at a party and things get
out of control or whatever.
So what would that have been?
Not necessarily been not like an
intentional thing, like, hey, check out
these pills I got, and this is how you
use them. That type of thing.
Or let's get somebody cornered and rape
them, right? That's not a
thing that I'm aware of, right?
I'm not saying it's not, but because I
think obviously there are
things like that, right?
Gang of rapes or gang assaults and shit
like that. And I would think in...
I don't know. That could be big time
college stuff. I don't know.
But to go back to what you said, you
heard of certain situations
that maybe got out of hand.
What does that mean?
I honestly can't think
of anything specific.
Okay.
Yeah.
So I think, I feel like, I think there's
definitely a lot of men like you who
never really came
across situations like that.
We're never obviously a part of anything
like that. Essentially we're raised to
respect women and to
not force themselves.
I don't know if we were, not to
necessarily raise to respect women.
But we're, I think, and what I mean by
that is, right, Jan Ersus, we talked
about this, I think, in episode one or
two, but the dumpster diving
for the playboys and stuff.
We grew up with, in
that age of 70s, 80s...
Objectifying women.
Objectifying women, pornography, the
advent of the super model, Sports
Illustrated Swimsuit Edition,
all the glamour magazines and all that
shit. So there was absolutely grew up in
the age of objectification of women.
But I don't know, where did we, I don't
even know where I was
going with this, but...
Well, you were talking about
being raised to respect women.
Sorry, I lost my train of thought.
But I, so I don't know if we were
necessarily raised to respect women.
We were at a family level, right?
But at the macro level and the societal
and cultural level, women have been
getting disrespected forever.
It's part of the culture.
And it's even worse in
other countries, right?
In the US, it's amazing.
This whole bare-versed man thing in the
US is completely different, I think, than
what goes on outside of the US.
Like even in Europe, right?
Europe is a very, there's some chauvinism
that still exists as part
of the fabric of the culture.
You go into say like the Middle East and
there's an absolute lack
of respect for women, right?
It's such a bad lack of respect for them
that they're forced to cover up.
So it's the dynamics on this
are actually very interesting.
But I think where you learn to respect
women is at a very micro
level, the family level.
So I grew up with my, I had six aunts and
I have a sister, a female cousin, other
female relatives, right?
So that's where you learn to respect
women or just people in
general, if that makes sense.
Yes, but I'm wondering where the line
gets crossed because women have been
objectified for years
and years and years.
And women have been assaulted for years
and years and years.
So what-
Men are physically stronger.
Men are physically stronger.
I'm curious what makes a man cross the
line from just objectifying a woman
to thinking he can assault a woman.
It's really-
It's a line that gets crossed.
Well, it's really, really fascinating
stuff and I hadn't
thought of it in this way.
But you look into like Carl Jung, you
know, even Freud, but Freud's a little
bit, you know, abstract.
And I think that's a lot about just how
it's the, you know, as individuals, we're
slowly becoming less
and less individuated.
And we're losing our individual identity
and it's becoming more of
this collective identity.
And when you get into that collective
identity, you have less
and less concept of yourself.
And now you're really prone to those
external factors around you.
And once that starts to happen, now you
feel less and less powerful.
So as the, you know, this-
It's a societal thing.
And it's happening, right?
The governments are kind of doing this in
some ways in that manipulation of-
We want individuals to feel less in
control and we want to pull
it more into the community.
But as you do that, as you pull away
someone's self-control, sense of
self-control and self-determination,
people react very differently to that.
And so you might have someone who is, you
know, as you think about the
psychology of the man who's
doing this kind of
stuff, it's a power play.
It's truly a power play.
It's not like it's not
a- it's a power play.
They're out to prove something and it's
because they're losers.
And they're losing on whatever fronts
that are around them,
whether it's financial,
or they don't feel they look
good enough or whatever, right?
They just lack the power in their own
lives that they have to
take it out on someone.
And the easiest thing to do is to take
control and overpower a
woman, physically speaking.
And that all makes sense.
And you can't even say that it's a thing
based on, you know, poor
versus rich or black versus white,
because there's many, many white rich
males who have raped girls.
It's not a sexual thing either.
And it's not sexual.
So for all of these men somewhere in
their lives, they don't
feel that they have control
or maybe an identity that
is authentic in some way.
And I think there's a lot of hate though
towards women from these men.
I don't think women like-
these men like women at all.
I don't know.
I mean, it's a fascinating thing because
what I just described is an outlet.
As fucked up as that is, it's an outlet.
So, you know, another outlet is to do
drugs or drink or exercise
or whatever, go become work,
work harder or whatever, right?
And but it's as an outlet,
that's a fucked up concept.
But I think that's part of it.
That's really interesting.
So they have whatever going
on inside of them, this anger,
this dissatisfaction with the world, with
life, with themselves,
with their situation.
They feel powerless.
They feel like losers, essentially, low
self-esteem, all of that crap.
And instead of going and shooting up or
drinking a bunch of alcohol or, you know,
dealing with it in other ways like that,
they use women because
they can overpower women.
It's something that they can take control
of, get some sort of satisfaction and
self-esteem hit because they were able to
overpower this woman and rape her.
Yeah. Or abuse her.
Or abuse her.
So, I mean, you know this, but when I was
in college, I
volunteered at a shelter for
battered and abused women and their kids.
Talk about a mind fuck, right?
Because, you know, I was there to
basically play with and as
a counselor in a sense for
the children, the kids, and playing
basketball, kickball, whippleball,
whatever, just talking.
Being a positive male role figure in
their lives, it was cool.
But it was cool in that sense to connect.
I still remember some of the kids and how
much they enjoyed me coming around.
But what got me out of it is it's crazy.
It's a cycle.
And the women that were there, they'd
come, they'd get
away, the guy would have,
they'd somehow reconcile.
The man would apologize.
And then what's most fucked up is say the
first time it's a slap and you leave.
That's not the case.
But the next time it's a punch and then
you leave and you go back,
it's probably a concussion
or a broken arm and
you leave, you come back.
It just escalates.
It escalates more and more because as
they leave, it's that thing.
It's like, why do you keep going back?
And I think for them, it's almost like
it's almost easier for
me to stay because then
it stays kind of minor
because it's that controlled, right?
It's the control of if you're here and
I've got control of you.
I'm a loser in all aspects of my life.
I financially, I'm just a piece of shit
or professionally I'm a piece of shit.
But I can flex on this one person and
have some sense of
control when everything else
is out of control.
It's really fucked up.
I mean, it's, I don't know how far away
from the bare versus man story we are,
but you know, as you
dig into it, it's crazy.
I think all of it is
why we choose the bare.
And it isn't even that these men are
losers financially or professionally.
That's just two things because there's
many very successful
men that are abusive.
I say that for lack of examples.
Right, right, right.
There's like so many different things.
But and to your point, I think a lot of
women don't leave
because they're afraid that
they're going to get killed.
I do think a lot of women fear for their
lives that if I leave
him, he will kill me
or he will, he will
take my children from me.
A lot of men use the children.
Well, the safe house that I volunteered
at was in the middle of
a neighborhood and you
would never know.
It just looked like a house.
Yeah.
And, and it was that way so that it was
completely concealed.
Just fit in.
Yeah, you'd never know.
It's, I think, I wonder how
much of it too is how these
boys are raised.
You know how much so if their fathers are
abusive, obviously
they are going to mimic
it.
But where did it come from?
So is it just passed down from generation
to generation to
generation until it's finally
broken?
It could go back hundreds of years.
If you have the same, well, if the
fathers are always doing
it and it's just continuing
being passed down,
when is the cycle broken?
I don't even, I don't know
if it even rolls like that.
I don't think it does.
I don't think that's suggesting there's
some genetic or
hereditary component here.
And I don't think that's in play per se.
It's, you know, I've thought about this
since this whole thing
we did this yesterday.
I'm blown away by the amount of action
and some of the visceral
responses from the women
out there who hate men, to the guys who
defend the man versus the bear.
And then the other folks who probably are
like me, the men who are like, oh, I pick
the bear every day.
What I think is interesting is you
probably don't, it's just
exposure and it's experience.
And what I mean by that, that's how most
things are solved, right?
If you're racist, the best way to cure
your racism is to go
spend some time with people
of another race.
You realize you got a
lot in common, right?
The racism is just ignorance.
When it comes to say women being afraid
of men, have a daughter.
You know, think about the
safety of your daughter.
Think about the safety of your wife.
And so it's really exposure.
I don't think that solves everything.
But if until you have a daughter or
you're married and
you're living in an area where
there's a city, any city in the world,
the US, there's exposure
to bad things happening.
If you are not married or have a
daughter, you may not
think about this stuff.
You may not hit your psyche.
And I hear what you're saying, but
there's many men who are
married and beat their wives.
And there's many men who have daughters
and I'm not an expert on this.
No, no, it's just very interesting.
I think it's a
culmination of many things.
I really, I think you really nailed a lot
with the outlet concept
that taking advantage of these
women overpowering them is a way for them
to feel better about
themselves as much as doing drugs or
drinking. It's the same. I never thought
about it as an outlet before using human
beings as an outlet.
Of course, it's all messed up.
I mean, molesting young children, that's
a whole different thing.
But I do think there's also some nature
versus nurture going
on there. I'm not saying
it's genetic, but I think mimicking what
you see growing up
definitely has a play in there.
If you see your dad hitting your mom and
you think part of you
either is going to completely...
Never saw it. I don't know.
But if a boy does,
modeling, modeling, exactly.
Then I think it's both. I think you grew
up watching it or you have
your own issues and you're
using women as an outlet. Then of course,
there's just psychopaths,
which I think to some level,
any man that can assault a woman has
sociopathic tendencies.
There's no question about it,
in my opinion.
It depends on what you mean. If it's
unprovoked, then sure. But if a guy gets
attacked by a woman,
No, I mean sexually assault.
Rape.
I got you.
The bear versus man thing isn't just
about rape. It's about torture. It's
about all the things we
know men have done to women. Women watch
and listen to true crime for many
reasons. One of them is to
be prepared in case something ever
happens to them. So it's
research for us. A lot of
it's entertainment and a lot of it's
research and to be prepared. But through
listening to true crime,
we learn what men really can do in the
worst case scenarios.
I mean, there was a girl just last week
went on a first date
and he dismembered her and
threw away parts of her body. I think
this happened in... Oh
gosh, I don't want to say
Atlanta or Nashville. I don't know. I
could be saying the wrong
town. I don't want to say
the wrong town. And they have him on
camera throwing away
different body parts throughout
the city. That was her first date. She
met him on hinge, which is a normal
dating site. It's not
the one where people just go on like
Tinder. Tinder's to like hook up. This
was just to actually meet
someone. It's crazy. It's crazy. So I
think that's what goes into this.
Well, what's crazier is depending on what
state this actually happened in.
Curious to see what happens. Yeah. Should
be shot. Honestly. I
agree. Hang the fucker. Just
shoot him and stop the nonsense. Don't
even entertain due
process and all that. Right.
But I agree. He's about to go on a
probably a 20, 30 year
process of appeals and whatever and
just drain the system. But piece of shit
should just be shot.
I always will feel that way and nothing
can ever change my mind on
that. But so I think this has
been very interesting. And I think it's
been very eyeopening to a lot
of men. A lot of men are very
perplexed by this. The bare verse. Yes.
They're there. They don't
get it. It's a no brainer.
But the men who I feel the men who don't
get it might be the problem.
They're part of the problem.
Because here I have a question for you,
though. Yeah. Because I know
us talking about it and me representing a
viewpoint that's not
say all pro male. Right.
I get it. I understand. I think men. I
was thinking about it.
Not all men are assholes,
but all men have potential to be and the
ability to be any man can be an asshole.
Right. Not everybody is all the time, but
we all are can be an
asshole by the minute. Right.
It can vary. What? So my question to you
is, what do you I'm in the camp of
choosing the bear because
I know men and I know the evil that men
can inflict upon anything
really the earth, women,
nature, whatever. Animals.
Yeah. That was nature. But yeah.
Me taking this position, what do you
think the response would
be to me taking that type of
position in that right? It's you think
I'll get the men who think I'm a
whatever. I think you know,
you know, to be that I think that there's
men like you who agree with you 100%
and get it. And I think that there's men
who think you're stupid
that are going to think you're
stupid and that I don't know if they'll
think you're anti man.
I'm so pro man. You are. I'm
100% man. I'm a guy's guy. Yeah. But I'm,
I'm pro people, pro human,
right? I think everybody's
individually do your thing. Right now. I
think, I think I'm curious.
I think that there's men who
will think that, you know, you're a
pussy. Yeah. You know, and that you're
weak. Yeah. And that
you're controlled by your woman. Like I
think probably that I'm
whipped. Maybe that's the right
word. I was trying to find, but I think
the men who think that way
are part of the problem by them
getting on social media and complaining
about this. All they are
doing is exposing themselves
as part of the problem. Yeah. And they're
too stupid to realize
that. I think it's hilarious.
The whole concept. I was like, what?
Yeah. Yeah. So you have two sons.
They have been raised or raising the
youngest still, but our oldest one,
I would say is a solid man is twenties.
He has high respect for women.
I think we both through the years would
talk once he was old
enough, talk to him about
no means no. You know, you don't,
especially with our youngest, because the
world has changed even
since our oldest was going through
school, but you don't touch
a girl at all. Even her hand,
even her arm, like you don't put your
hands on a girl without
her consent to anything.
I think that's even gotten more extreme
with our youngest versus our oldest.
So the whole respect, don't touch all
that. And then even when you're at a
party and if you see
a girl passed out and her friends, you
can't find them, you do not leave her
alone. I remember our
oldest Nathan was at a party and called
me and said, I'm going to be
late for curfew. This was a
high school party. I'm going to be late
for curfew because
there's this girl she's passed
and I need to find her friends. And I
said, that's completely
fine. When you find her friends
and then come home. So in addition to
those things, I think
it's imperative that parents
who have sons have these conversations.
You have to. I had this conversation
about not touching a
girl at all with Dylan when he was in
first grade, I think. I said,
you don't touch her anywhere.
I never thought about having to have that
conversation with Nathan because things
weren't quite the same as they are in
society now. But even with
Nathan, I think I had the
no means no conversation in middle school
when he started making out with girls and
explaining that to him. So I think every
parent with their boys needs to have
these conversations,
needs to make a clear and revisit this
conversation in high school and explain
and just go over it,
make it a very normal thing to talk
about. But in addition to that, can you
think of other ways,
other things we did, or you as a father,
you did to instill
respect for women in our sons?
Nothing necessarily comes to mind. I can
honestly admit I wouldn't
have had those conversations.
If I was a single dad, maybe I might have
gone to a class, watched a
YouTube video or something.
How do I do this? How do I bring a mom
influence in a single dad situation? So
maybe people should do that.
I think, you know, am I the perfect role
model? No. Am I a decent one? Probably.
I'm not the worst, I guess, right on the
scale of good to bad or whatever.
Somewhere not too
far. You're pretty good.
Never have I hit you. No, no, no, it's
that kind of stuff. It's the
listen to your mom. I had to
have a conversation with Dylan the other
day. Yep. Our youngest got him in the
car, had him trapped,
go into the game. And we talked about
things like that. And just
reinforcing the respect and
acknowledgement of, you know, just
really, really the respect level.
How about the fact that you raised the
boys? Well, this would
really apply to Nathan and
Kaya because they were closer in age, but
Dylan too, that they were
never allowed to hit Kaya,
put their hands on Kaya. It was a, there
was a, you know,
tolerance. You know, it's funny,
actually, now that I think about it. So
the fastest, the absolute
fastest I ever saw my dad move
is when I don't know how old I was, but
my sister and I got into an
argument. And I think we squared
up and she popped me in the lip and I was
ready. I don't know what I
was going to do. I was so
surprised. This wasn't common, but it's
not tarnishing. That is
not a big deal. It's actually
funny. And he was sitting on the couch
and I think I was ready to
go back and he was between us
within a fraction of a second. I wonder
if she even remembers
this. And I got the full
dissertation of never touching your
sister, your mom. I don't know what all
was said, right? But
she left an impression that had to have
been, I don't know, 40 years
ago. So it's part of my DNA.
It's probably part of theirs. I was still
from the generation of
hold the door for women.
You know, we still do that. And maybe
that's a gen X thing, but
we all grew up, hold the door
for a woman and women's liberation. And
you guys are shooting
yourselves in the foot on that one.
But that's, I've always told them, hold
the door for your mom, hold
the door for your grandmother.
Hold the door for that lady, right? The
door for that elderly
person. Give up their seat,
give up your seat. Yeah. Whatever it is.
Right. It's, yeah, I was
just in the hairdressers with
a decent person. Well, but I mean, you're
saying that, but these are
things that need to be taught.
And I would say with the new generations,
I don't know how much of it is being
taught. I don't know.
I'm being honest. I don't know. I do know
I was in the hairdresser
with Dylan a couple of weeks ago
and him and I both had seats and an older
woman walked in and he got
up and gave her his seat.
Did you have to tell him? I just looked
at him and then he looked,
he didn't know she was there.
And then he saw her and got up. Yeah. But
you know, I, but it's
again, we've told them these
things, but I specifically remember you
telling Nathan, you
never touch your sister.
That's where I was going. So that story,
I relayed to both of them. Yes. Over
time. I know I've told
Nathan that. Yeah. And you know, he asked
questions and Dylan too.
Yeah. Because once Dylan got old
enough, you were like, you cannot touch
your sister. Yeah. I won't
say our kids are perfect,
not by any means, but they're pretty
good. But it's, it is
kind of fun now to see that.
I don't know if I've had any of those
moments yet with Dylan. I know he's held
the door for people,
whether I don't know what, maybe at a
hotel or wherever, but restaurants. I've,
but I've seen Nathan do it and I've seen
Nathan actively engage in
a conversation with someone
and make it okay that I'm holding the
door or I'm going to do
something that's respectful for you,
which is cool. Yeah. As they've, as he's
now, is he considered a man
yet or is he still a young man?
No, I'd say he's now a
man. He's probably a man. Yes.
Doing those kinds of things. Right. So
it's cool. I observed
Dylan doing that. We were,
we were at the library and one of my
girlfriends was coming out with her
daughter. He was going in
and I was dropping him off and she said
hi to him. And then he stopped and
exchanged some pleasant
trees with her as instead of just saying
hi and then keeping
walking, he stopped and awkward,
you know, awkwardly did his, did a polite
thing. He knew that it's
ingrained in them that they
could do that. And I think there's a lot
of kids and a lot of young
adults that do that, but there
are, there are, there are, but I, I don't
know how common it is. I
think it might be less common than
it was back in the day for us. I could be
wrong, but I mean, I can
speak down in South Florida.
It's not as common for people to hold the
door as they're walking into
a place. I can't tell you how
many people just let the door close
behind them when I'm coming up onto the
door. Like if you're
Nordstrom's or Macy's, someone's going in
the door. I always look behind me and
hold to see if anyone's
behind me to hold the door more often
than not. People down here in South
Florida are not doing
that. So, and when you do do it, people
are so grateful because it's
not common. That's a common
courtesy thing, but is that a cultural
thing? I cannot. Of course.
Yeah, I can't not. Is that
a cultural thing or is that just dying
out? Common courtesy. I feel
like I was at the, you know,
like Macy's or something at the mall over
the Christmas. I got
stuck. Like five or six people,
you know, I held the door for one
person's like, all
right, everyone's so excited.
I mean, we're off topic, but I think that
there is, it's, it's incredibly
important. Not that this
will stop someone from assaulting a
woman, but ingraining that respect
towards women has got
home. It must, it's imperative. It has
to. I think, you know, this will really
fire some people up,
but I do think women need to work a
little bit more closely
together too. You guys really,
you need to support each other better.
It's, you know, I'm not
saying you guys are your own worst
enemy, but you, it'd be nice if women
stuck together a little bit
tighter than sniping on one
another as easily as they do. It's really
interesting because I
think that the Gen Z
women are, their girlhood is strong. And
I think there's so much
more support for each other
than I would say the Gen X women growing
up because society
pitted us against each other
that we should be in competition with
each other for a man. So if
a woman is prettier than you,
you automatically should hate her. Be
jealous of her instead of
being like, Oh, she's beautiful.
Do you think that's being taught by other
Gen X or seven kids?
I think that, well, I think when we were
growing up as a girl, as a
girl, that's how it was. You
were in competition. You had your friends
and you loved them, but
other women were competition.
Whereas now I feel with the new
generation in general, I'm saying in
general, they celebrate
each other. Now I'm not saying there
isn't jealousy. I've
witnessed horrendous jealousy
towards my own daughter as she was
growing up. But I think that
in general, there is a lot more
support for each other. There's a lot
more celebration of each other's
successes. Of course,
there's pettiness and jealousy and
scheming and all that
crap that always goes on.
But I see more with this younger
generation, a unification and support.
And I don't know about
the millennials, with the women in that
group. I really don't know how they are
as far as supporting
each other and stuff. And I feel like Gen
X women, as we've gotten
older, have woken up more
to, hey, we're not each other's enemies.
We were kind of set up that
way, but we really aren't.
And so I think we have woken up. I feel
personally, I'm going
to speak for myself.
I have learned so much from the Gen Z
women I've met. I admire
them so much. And I've learned
a lot about... What's Gen Z? Kaiya? Well,
no, it's all three of our kids. But I'm
talking about Kaiya's
age, which is early twenties. I've
learned a lot about... I've reflected a
lot about how I grew up
and how it was with the different women I
grew up around, the
girls I grew up around.
So I think that they definitely are a
force to be reckoned with. And I hope
they continue to unite
and support each other. But you're right.
There is always going
to be a group of women
that are going to put down other women.
And that could just be
the way it is. I think about
Caitlin Clark, right? Basketball player.
Yeah. And I can't remember
her name. The girl from LSU,
is it maybe Gabrielle Reese? I don't
think that's her name.
But so Caitlin Clark,
there's people that are hating on her.
Yes. But there is another group that's
come to her defense.
And the girl at LSU, I wish I knew her
name. It's a good basketball
player. And well, Caitlin's a
white girl and the girl from LSU is a
black girl. And they're both very good.
And the girl from LSU,
they won the championship last year. And
they were trying to repeat
this year. And she talked
about how this is the hardest year of her
life because so many
people were hating on her. And
there were people coming to her defense
and stuff, but it's just crazy. The
amount of just hate and
sniping that was happening for both of
them. For both of them.
It's crazy. They're irrelevant.
They're both good basketball players.
Yes. I think they're both
decent people. Yes. They look
different. They maybe listen to different
music, maybe wear
different clothes, whatever. But I
think they're both decent people and
they're both trying to do something.
Right. But the amount of
shitting on them is remarkable. Yeah. But
they have had people come
to their defense as well.
So maybe you're right. It's there's an
evolution. It blows my mind. The women
that would snipe on these young women, I
don't understand it at
all, especially because these
women bring attention to women's
basketball. So to see other
women go at them, especially
outside of that, it's just that they're
successful. Yes. And they're just,
they're successful people.
There's no reason to try to take them
down. You do not gain anything by
shitting on them. No,
I mean, that's a whole nother thing to
talk about is women uplifting
women. And, but I think again,
this whole bear versus man topic, women
have come together. That's
an area we've come together.
I don't know any women who've chosen the
man from what I've seen.
They might be out there.
And I haven't seen any father. She's the
man. You asked me as a woman, man,
did the same question get asked of women?
That's how it started. It
is. What do you mean? A man was
on, it was an interview. It was a guy on
the street. I think I
could be wrong. This was the
original, but I think this is the
original. And he asked a girl, if you
were alone in the woods,
who would you rather be with a bear or a
man? And she chose the bear.
And I think he was surprised.
Did she hesitate? No, that's funny. No,
she did not choose the bear. She did not
hesitate. I'm sorry.
She chose the bear right away. So I
wouldn't, like I said, I think
this is an area most women can
relate to. And I think the men who are
having a temper tantrum about
this are exposing themselves
to a problem. But I think they're too
stupid to realize that. And
I say that in all confidence
as a strong woman. I think men need to do
better. Obviously, right? That's not a
good commentary on us.
Definitely need to probably pick it up
there a little bit.
Absolutely. I think being held
to your point as far as punishable
offenses, if they were could
get in more trouble for what
they're doing, if the sentences were
stronger and longer, then I
think they wouldn't take these
chances of doing this. I feel like
there's just kind of this
subtle vibe of they might get away
with it. So like, I don't think they're
in fear of fear is not
stopping them from doing it,
especially when there's gang
rapes and it's being filmed.
But, you know, I mean, the audacity is
heinous. It's horrible. It's horrible.
So the bear, the bear is what will always
get chosen. I can't think
of any reason a man would
ever be chosen. Isn't that crazy? That is
crazy. So that's our man
versus bear. What a topic.
Jeez.
Commentary for today. That's
our opinions on that subject.
And I think I think I will get lit up
personally. You probably will.
Yeah, I'm sure. Oh, you know,
but yeah, we will fight the good fight.
We welcome all comments, questions,
anything you guys want to say, we welcome
it. So all right.
We're out until next time.
All right. See everybody. Bye.