Episode 69 - GenX Speaks Series: Gina Scott Williams - GenX Gina66

Welcome to Gen X Adulting. And today we have Gina Scott Williams with us, also known as Gen X. Gina. Welcome, Gina. Thank you. We're so happy to have you here. Our first question is always, what year were you born? nineteen sixty six, October. I will be sixty this year. my gosh. Okay. So that's unbelievable because you don't look like you're about to turn 60 at all. And so does that make you one of the first no, the first is 65, I think, right? Okay. So you're you are. You are. But you don't look it. You don't look it at all. ⁓ okay, so where where were you born? Yeah. Thank you. Mm-hmm. Yeah, so I'm w almost OG. Almost. Yeah. Thank you. Lubbock, Texas, up in the panhandle, where it's dry and flat. Okay. And do you know how many generations back in your family, like why they settled there? Was it your grandparents, was your great grandparents? My mom was born in a little Texas town called Tahoka. And I think my gr I think the way they got there was my mom's dad, which my grandfather was a farmer and he was a cotton farmer and the cotton's out in Lubbock. So as you're driving into Lubbock, you see all the cotton. And so I think that's how they how they got there. Mm-hmm. I'm pretty sure. Because he lived in Leveland, which was like Okay. Okay. Fifteen minutes from Lubbock. So I'm pretty sure that's how they got there so he could farm. Yeah. Okay. And that was on your mom's side, your mom's parents? My mom's dad. Mm-hmm. That's a complicated Yeah. Yeah, that's a that's a whole nother episode probably. Your mom's dad. Do you know how your how your maternal grandparents met?

My mom's dad. Mm-hmm. That's a complicated Yeah. Yeah, that's a that's a whole nother episode probably. Your mom's dad. Do you know how your how your maternal grandparents met? No, I wasn't close to my grandparents. it was a weird dynamic. My my grandfather, who I was speaking about, was an alcoholic. And I don't remember him being an alcoholic. He was sober by the time I knew him, but there was no relationship really generated with either set of my grandparents with us, except for just visiting. Now, my mom's mom was a was mentally unhealthy. And all I remember about Granny is her laying on the couch, pretty much drugged up. I mean, they put her in a sanatorium, like when she I don't know, it's a long yeah. ⁓ and all this today it would just be she was bipolar. wow. But back then you're crazy. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. We Yes. Well, I mean, women mental okay, first of all, mental health wasn't discussed at all. But women especially, that wasn't acknowledged. You think of all the women that had d manic depression, bipolar, whatever, and were just treated that way. It's actually heartbreaking when you think about it. So and that's when they had the ⁓ I was gonna say where they sent her. They don't even have Mm-hmm. Nope. Mm-hmm. Yep. It is. So all I remember. go ahead. Mm-hmm. Do they even do that anymore? Like send people away? I don't think so. Sadly they're on the streets now, I think. No. Mm-mm. Mm-mm. No. But all I remember about her is is just laying on the couch with a dachshund on her chest, because we always had one. And you know, my my gr my stepgrandfather, Papa Cecil, ⁓ you know, fetching her things. Cecil get me some tea. Cecil get me, you know, that's all I remember. I was closer to my stepgrandfather than I was. any of my biological grandparents. So mm-hmm.

that's so interesting. And did you live close, like in proximity to where they were? They lived in Dallas. They lived in Dallas and I wasn't here yet, but I was in Lubbock. And ⁓ so it was like a it's about a six hour drive. So we would come in the summer, you know, and stuff stuff like that. Okay. Now, did your mom have siblings that live near you? Like did you have aunts and uncles? Yes. Okay, so my mom's sister, Aunt Jackie, was my second mom, basically. Well, I had two second moms that were aunts. But Aunt Jackie, they lived, I have five cousins on that side. And they lived, they cleared some land in a little town called Navasota, Texas, that's like 20 minutes from college station where ⁓ Aunt is. And so they cleared some land and built a farm. So when I was little, it was summers there because my mom was a single mom and she needed someone, she needed babysitters in the summer. And my sisters are nine, eleven, and 13 years older than me. So they were doing their own things by the time I was like 10. They're in college. They're, you know. And so I spent four to six weeks every summer at the farm. I mean, we're talking getting up at five with my uncle and milking cows. gathering eggs, all the things that children dream of in childhood, I did riding horses. They had a little neighbor, Mary Lynn, who would take me on the horses. And that was what saved me from the trauma of childhood, to be honest with you. Mm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that makes sense. And so that was for a good most of your summer, right? It sounds like.

Mm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that makes sense. And so that was for a good most of your summer, right? It sounds like. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Until until I was about, I think I quit going. They quit they like the farm quit existing. They they stopped like they sold other animals and and got rid of it. So I still went in the summer, but it wasn't the same, you know, with all the animals and stuff. But I think I stopped going for summers when I was old enough to stay home alone. Which Gen X, Gen X, you know, we're talking. Okay. Well Yeah, I mean for the next eight. No, maybe six. Six. Yeah, because I used to walk home from I used to walk home from first grade and stay by myself till five thirty. But I I mean like I didn't want to go anymore because I had neighborhood friends and I had friends that, you know, so I just got I kind of outgrew it. But those were the best times of my life. Yeah. yeah. yeah. Yeah. No, those early formative years, it does sound perfect. So you said your your sisters were significantly older than you. So are do you when your mom had them, was that the same dad as you and there was just a big space? Okay. So she had those your three sisters with their dad? Yes. Mm-hmm. No. No. Mm-hmm. Yes, they my mom's first husband was and I can't I'm not gonna get into the to the other stuff until we talk about my childhood a little more, but ⁓ they were born to her and her first husband. And then I was born much later in a different story. Okay. Okay. So is it four four girls total? And I have a half brother too, who is actually fifteen years older than me, who's ex military, ⁓ who lives in Punta Corta. Okay. Okay. So now and are do they have the same dad, the ⁓ your half brother and your three sisters? Yeah. No. But is it all the same mom?

Okay. Okay. So now and are do they have the same dad, the ⁓ your half brother and your three sisters? Yeah. No. But is it all the same mom? Yes, no. He's not Stuart is not my mom's biological child. It that was her stepson, but she was just as he was even closer to my mom than he was his own mom. And so we share a dad, but not really. Yes, by a lot. Yeah. Okay. Okay, okay. Gotcha. So you're the baby. And but then growing up it sounds like ever all your siblings were significantly older than you. So was it more like you felt a little bit like an only child in the house? Yes, very much, very much. And do you know how your mom and dad met? Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna tell you about my biological father first. Okay. I never I never met I never met my biological father. ⁓ I I don't want to mess up that story, but I didn't know about him. ⁓ okay. Okay. Okay, let's do that. Okay. So ⁓ I don't know how they met. I really don't. but he was a alcoholic. She chose those alcoholics. ⁓ he was an alcoholic and lazy and he wouldn't get off the couch. And she told him one day, ⁓ either get off the couch and get a job or get out. And she never saw him again. And she she was seven months pregnant with me. Okay, so you never knew him. Mm-mm. Mm-mm. Even when I met, I'm telling y'all, ⁓ even when I met the children that I didn't know existed from him, which are five more siblings, I still never met him. They my half brother Gary, who I met and hung out with a little bit, wanted to take me to New Orleans to meet Ed, and Ed did not have the courage. Wow.

Wow. to to meet me and to be honest with you I'm sorry I keep hitting this to be honest with you I don't care it it I don't care there's nothing about me that feels empty because I did not meet him he I I look at him as a sperm donor and that's it like I don't there was never any longing like an adopted child wants to seek out their their biological parent I never had that urge never never Mm. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Now what when you met your ⁓ your one half sibling from your biodad, did were there any similarities between you and him that you recognized? You all look so so you We all look alike. We all look alike. Mm-hmm. Everyone from Ed has strawberry blonde hair, the straight eyebrows, the darker eyebrows with the blonde hair, ⁓ this little crease when I smile. ⁓ I have my mom's eyes and that's about it. Everything else was from him. Yeah. Okay. So that had to have been something though when you met your half brother to be looking at someone who looks so much like you. Well, the interesting part of that too, Nicole, is that my two, well, all three of my all three of my sisters, I I believe, went to high school with the two oldest from my bio dad's first marriage. They were the same age. So they went to high school together. Okay. So they were step siblings at high school, right? And then all of a sudden, No way. Did they know that? Did did did they know they were related? Okay, all right. Uh-huh. yeah. They were had they were stepbrother and sister. They I wasn't born yet. I wasn't born yet. Okay, so I my mom was pregnant with me, and they got married before she got pregnant. And so my sisters went to high school with ⁓ Gary and Brenda, who were my bio dad's children from his first marriage. And then all of sudden, he's out. My mom's still pregnant. Mm. Okay. Okay.

Mm. Okay. Okay. My dad steps in when my mom was eight and a half months pregnant, and all of a sudden these poor teenagers who were so excited about having a baby sister. That's it. They don't and they could not my sisters could not talk about me at school. They couldn't ask questions. They couldn't show pictures. Nothing. Wow. Cause how old would the boys have been? Like would they have been like fifteen, sixteen, like that age when this was going over? Yeah. mm, mm. I would say Sophomore junior. Yeah. That would be rough because you think you're getting this little sister, then all this upheaval happens. And these other three step siblings who are really, I guess, no longer your step siblings because the separation has occurred, they know about you and l are living with you and what's going on with you, but they can't tell these boys about you. That had to have been so traumatic for everyone involved, all those kids. That's that and Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm. Yeah. Yes. Yes. Mm-hmm. Yes, yes. Isn't But then she met your that crazy? dad. It is crazy. It is crazy. So and then she met your dad like a month and a half after your biodad and her split. See, my that was a setup ⁓ from friends. They set my dad, my dad and ⁓ my mom up on a date. And my dad was a charming Yeah. Love bombing, narcissistic, con man. Okay. So he swoops in, saves the day, takes on a eight-month pregnant woman with three daughters. My sisters say he was the best stepdad. And ⁓ my mom knew that before she met him, that he was in prison. She knew that. Mm.

Mm. And he was a white, he was a white collar con man, you know, rob Peter to pay Paul, that kind of thing. You've heard that adage. ⁓ so she knew he'd been in prison, but here she was, a single mom with expecting a baby and three daughters to raise. So she allowed him to swoop in and save her. And she told me later it was always it was always in the back of her head that he's gonna screw up, you know. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's gonna screw up. Keep in mind, this is the mid-60s. I mean, there are not a lot of options for women in general, except for secretarial work, nursing, maybe. I mean, we're talking, and it the women's movement and all had not happened yet. People don't realize that. It really hadn't happened. Women weren't really entering the workforce in the way they started doing in the late 70s and 80s, where it was encouraged and accepted. So yeah, she's in survival mode. She's got these three girls and a baby. Yes. No no Mhm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. No. Mm-mm. Right. Mm. She lived her life in survival mode. Every bit of it. From childhood. Mm-hmm. She had a rough childhood. Yeah. I would g I I would guess that. Well, right, 'cause you talked about her mom ha had bipolar, right? And so Well, yes, and she she and my aunt Jackie used to hide under the bed and watch their father beat their mother. I mean it was bad. Yeah. Yeah. So she lived her life in flight or fight ⁓ fight or flight mode, which is what I feel like I've done for the majority of my life.

Right. Right. Exactly. Exactly. Well, yeah, I'm sh and you're I think that's very consistent with our generation, especially so many of us went through mental, emotional, physical trauma, ⁓ or one one, two, or three of that. ⁓ and then the upheaval of divorce, of remarriages, ⁓ there's just and no one talking to us about any of it. It's just you just keep going, like it didn't happen. We're just gonna keep going, everything's fine. Yes. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-mm. Nope. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. but yeah, talk about fight or flight, ⁓ all of that. But ⁓ you were gonna ask something, I was yeah, well, two things. ⁓ what was the what was his motivation to come in and s and be the savior? Like what what was in it for him? Mm-hmm. That's his MO. That's image. Image. Narcissus narcissists, their most important thing to a narcissist is their image. And he was in a in a friend group. And a woman who was my mom's best friend, Pat, introduced her to him when he got out of prison. And Okay. He looks good. Okay. My mom needed someone to save the day and he he did. And to be honest with you, my sisters say he was a great stepdad. I have no memories of him because ⁓ that's a well we can get into that, but I did want to tell you a story real quick. ⁓ when I was 19, my mom was in the hospital and she had a lot of mental health issues, so she was in the hospital. Quit digging in the couch. and I was I had taken my shift to go visit her and I came home to my mom's house. I think I lived in the dorm maybe, but I came home to my mom's house while my sisters went. And this is one of those universe control moments. Okay. You can call it a God moment if you're Christian, whatever you want to call it. I'm sitting in a chair reading a Texas Monthly Magazine. And as if I had no control over my body, I got up, walked straight down the hall of my mother's house, my house, and went straight to her nightstand, lifted up some crap, and underneath it was an envelope that I had seen as long as I can remember that said Olin Mills, which is where we always got our picture taken, two o'clock. I'd I'd seen this letter in there, this envelope in there for years. Never once had curiosity about it. It was an it was an appointment. Walked straight in there, took it out and read it. And it was a letter from my dad. Not my I'll say biodad if I mean biodad. ⁓ my dad saying, I know it's not my baby, but I wanna raise her I wanna raise it of my own. I wanna marry you, I wanna the love bombing letter, basically.

Right. So that was my first Right. knowledge that my dad was not my dad. When you were nineteen. Yes. I had been lied to by everyone in my family my whole life. So that's how you find it up. Because the sisters knew, because they were old enough, they were there when all this went down. Everyone knew. Yeah. That was a rough. Mm-hmm. Everybody knew. Yeah. Yeah. So how did you confront who did you confront first? You couldn't my sister, I called my sister, my Lubbock sister, Nancy. I called her and just I guess I was like just bawling so hard that she thought someone had died or something. She's trying to, you know, she's like, I can't understand you. Get your and I told her that I found a letter and knew that Lynn was not my dad. And she said, get over here. And she just lived, she didn't live very far away at the time. And she told me everything. And we cried together. And then she showed me pictures of Mm-hmm. The two siblings that she went to high school with. And I just, when I saw Brenda, the daughter, I just, I couldn't take my eyes off of her because it looked just like me. Like I just would, and it was I always felt like there was something wrong. Something's not right. I'm very intuitive. And even as a child, I would ask my mom, are you sure that? Mm. I'm not adopted because I'm the only blonde. ⁓ I somehow I was focused on that. I'm the only blonde. Everybody else has dark hair. And ⁓ I just didn't feel like I fit. And she would show me my birth certificate. She said, I bet I showed you your birth certificate 50 times. And it said October 10th. Right, right. Yeah.

Right, right. Yeah. 1966. No, not. my birth certificate said obviously October and it had my dad's name on it. You can put anyone on there. You put anyone on birth certificate. So she always told me they got married on October 10th, a year before I was born. They got married on October 10th, and I was born on the 25th. So she had tricked me basically ⁓ to show me that yes, I did belong. Yes, I was her and yes, this was my father. And Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. ⁓ so seeing Brenda's face and feeling like I do look like somebody made me there's there was this sense of belonging that I had never felt, even though it was catastrophically devastating to my psyche when this happened. Feeling like I do look like somebody had this, I had this new identity. Ident I had this brand new identity. Yeah. Yeah. So it's crazy. I I can't imagine the feelings ca talk about two ends of the spectrum because you're feeling betrayed and like the rugs pulled out from under you and completely disillusioned, I'm assuming. And ⁓ no foundation to stand, just like I would assume like emotionally, mentally falling into a pit almost. But then that knowing that that feeling negative your whole life that something's off, you don't totally f fit in this puzzle, and then finding the puzzle you fit in. Yes. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And the posit the weirdly positive feelings that come with that. How to meld that? Like how did you reconcile this? Did you is that when you met one of your biodads siblings? Or you're sibling with them?

Mm-hmm. Yes. Okay, so let me after my sister told me everything, she told my mom that I that I knew, right? And my mom, my mom couldn't talk about things. She just didn't have the strength. I mean, I don't I back when I look back, I think I blamed her for a lot of things that literally she just didn't have it in her. Yeah. Okay. Back then, you know how our parents were, we didn't talk about important things. So my sister told her I knew nothing. ⁓ my sister told her I knew. And so my sister took me to my mom's house. And my mom, I'll never forget it. She laid on the she was laying on the couch looking straight ahead. She could not look at me. She could not make eye contact with either one of us. And Nancy said, you know, Gina knows. Nothing. ⁓ blah blah blah. And then my mom said I did what I thought was right. And that was a That's that generation. That generation they they they just didn't talk 'cause that's 'cause when when was she born, your mom? Was she silent jen or was she boomer? Yes, silent. She didn't have me till she was thirty-four. So that was a that was really old to have a baby back then. So she was silent Jen. Silent Gen. Yeah. Yes, yes. They but they that generation didn't talk about anything. And so there's a rural aspect to this too. True. But it's you're out in the country in a way. Right. Right. So I'm sure Mm mm. No. No, Lubbock's Lubbock, no, it's not country. I lived in the city. Mm-hmm. Lubbock is a is a Lubbock is a city of 250,000. It's not a small town or anything, but it's it's still because of the university, it's a very cohesive community. everything is red and black for Texas Tech in the ⁓ in the fall. And so it's a real cohesive community, but it's definitely not country.

It's a city? Okay. Okay. Okay, okay. See how Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Probably what threw you off was that she spent time on the farm. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Which would probably be out at your aunt's house, but she was like on the outskirts more. Is that what that was? Yeah. At my aunt's house, yeah. Mm-hmm. they just cleared s they just cleared some land in the middle of nowhere in the forest and built a house. Yeah, it was awesome. Yeah, I that's awesome. So your mom says I did what I thought was right and and that's it. And then you're left to process it all. ⁓ was your sister a huge support through you processing that or were you kind of on your own? Pretty much. my gosh, shit. She probably saved my she probably saved my life. She probably saved my life. But Okay. And how much older is she than you? Nine years. So you're nineteen, so she's like twenty eight when this is going on about? Mm-hmm. She had babies, I know that. I know she had at least had Lindsay. So yeah. But before that, can we back up? Okay. Yeah, yeah. I wanted to go way back because I was gonna 'cause you're I was gonna go we did, we did, and we'll c and we'll we'll it'll we'll come back up to the that point as well. ⁓ but so they get married and they have you and was your mom a stay at home mom? We've skipped a lot. Okay. No, he wasn't working. She had to work. Okay, so he's not so he doesn't have a job. That was the motivation. the house. Right. No you're not. Not my not my bi not my bio dad. He was sitting on the couch, you know, drinking. No, no, but your your dad, your dad, when they got married and had you was he working?

Not my not my bi not my bio dad. He was sitting on the couch, you know, drinking. No, no, but your your dad, your dad, when they got married and had you was he working? he was yes. yeah, he was a yes, he was he made good money. He was a he what he used to be a long tra long haul trucker and then he became dispatcher and just moved up in the company. Okay. Okay, okay. So was she a stay at home mom when he was doing that? I think so. I think so. I I don't know that. You know what? I don't know that for sure. I don't know that for sure, but I'm assuming. Okay, so she's raising you. Yeah, like like when you were little 'cause you said when you were little during those really those early years, let's say zero to five, it sounds like that's the summers you went to Aunt Jackie's, right? No, I didn't start going to Aunt Jackie's until I was about seven. I was I was a mama's I didn't want to leave. I was scared to ⁓ even spend the night people's houses. I was a homebody s that early. I I ⁓ I wouldn't have left. I I I think I had to at least been seven or eight because I don't think I would have left my mom. So I'm sure my sisters were babysitting me. Okay, so during Okay. So your mom might have been home with you during those really early years home or maybe working, you're not sure. ⁓ but were your were your sisters gone though? Were they like already at college when you were that young? Or were some of them still in the house? I don't know. I don't remember any of my sisters being in the house. Okay. So was your dad still in the house with your mom during those early years? Like that zero to seven year was he round? Not your dad but your dad. Till I was seven. Till I was seven.

Okay. So was your dad still in the house with your mom during those early years? Like that zero to seven year was he round? Not your dad but your dad. Till I was seven. Till I was seven. Until you were seven. Okay. So you guys are kind of living like just a normal life, right? She's taking care of you. He's middle upper class. He's going work. Okay. Everything's humming along. Middle middle upper class, middle upper class. Mm-hmm. ⁓ they move apparently, I don't have any memories, very few memories of childhood. Apparently, ⁓ they moved a lot into newer houses or better houses, or and then my mom would have a brand new Cadillac in the driveway, and then two weeks later it would be gone and replaced with a Lincoln Town car or a you know, so That is setting up that's setting up the story of what happened when I was seven. My Okay. Okay, so there's a lot of moving around, new cars, new houses, and then what happened when you were seven? Well, the moving around and the new cars and then them disappearing and is because he was he was robbing Peter to pay Paul and and conniving and and stealing and embezzling and ⁓ then he went to prison when I was seven and I was told I was told they were getting a divorce. My mom was in her bathroom. And I was sitting on her bed, and that's how she told me from her bathroom. We're getting divorced, and that's all I was told. So again, I began a life of lies till I was nineteen. No, till I was thirteen. Yeah, so everyone lied to me again. So wait, when she told you okay, so instead of telling you he was going to prison, she told you they're getting divorced. And he's leaving.

So wait, when she told you okay, so instead of telling you he was going to prison, she told you they're getting divorced. And he's leaving. And and was he just kind of there one day and gone the next? Did he ever have like a closure convers so he never had a closure conversation with you of saying goodbye or anything? Apparently. No. Now they took him straight from the courthouse. That's gonna say they don't say go home and say goodbye to your family and close off any local business. So not only gone. Right. So not only were you told we're getting divorced, but it's almost like we're getting divorced and he's gone. There's no seeing him on the weekends. He abandoned you. Is that what you were told? And so no. that's how you felt okay. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Relatable. ⁓ so okay. Yes, he abandoned you. Mm-hmm. No, that's how always that's my issues. That's my adult issues. Fear of abandonment. Yeah. ⁓ So then he's just gone. And was was there ever a time that you remember asking your mom, can I see him or where is he? Or any of that? Mm-hmm. You you didn't ask your mom and I was so intimidated and protective of her feelings and she taught me to be fearful of confrontation or ⁓ important conversations because I watched her not have them. So I I probably did, I don't know, but I would get letters from him from prison quite often. And I'm sure my little brain couldn't understand why can you write me letters, but I can't see you? I was told he was on the truck, ⁓ working on the truck. But why can't I ever see you? Right. Yes, that makes sense. And he probably knew and but he probably didn't mention anything about prison in the letters, right? He was going along with the story. Okay. Okay.

Right. Yes, that makes sense. And he probably knew and but he probably didn't mention anything about prison in the letters, right? He was going along with the story. Okay. Okay. So I got I did get letters. no. Mm-hmm. Now when I used when I looked back, when I looked back, ⁓ I still had some of the letters after I found out, ⁓ which is the next part of the story. you could see in the address Huntsville, Texas, where the prison is. But the rest of it was my dad had beautiful handwriting and it was just this kind of scribble and then Huntsville, Texas, which I don't even know why I put a return address on it to begin with, but ⁓ Yeah. I would look back and go, Yep, it says Huntsville, Texas. That's where the big prison is in Texas, the federal prison. So, ⁓ but Okay. But you're little. You you know, you're not gonna correlate that at that time. No. And let me just tell you at this point, because it'll it'll get relevant later, it'll become relevant. ⁓ he was a third striker, he was sent to prison for life. But let me remind you, he was the third striker. But let me remind you that my dad was very charming. So let me just remind you of that. wow. When that happened? Okay. Okay. So that's gonna I have a feeling that's gonna revisit. Was that his third strike when you were seven? Yeah. Yeah. Wow. So dur Mm-hmm. Yes. He was he wasn't coming out. He wasn't coming back. During this time okay, so so that explains why the farm became such a safe space for you. Going out to the farm. Right. Yes, my aunt especially. My aunt did have important conversations with me. My aunt cooked with me. She taught me things. She she was a teacher to begin with, but she loved me in a way that my mom never did. Yeah, okay. Okay. So she filled that mother role. Yeah.

Yeah, okay. Okay. So she filled that mother role. Yeah. Just different. Just yes. And my Aunt Joo, who was my dad's sister. She's the one that was so protective of the secret. I was her baby. I was her favorite and everyone knew it. And I wasn't even her biological niece. But she was the one who was so protective of the ⁓ secret. And do you know, Nicole, that we never talked about it after I found out? Yeah. Right. We never spoke about it. She knew I knew. I knew she knew I knew. But we never talked about it. Amazing. It's just it's that it's amazing how much we were reinforced to just grind through everything because there was zero space made for us to have any thoughts, emotions, anything about what was going on. No one made that space for us. It was just like you just keep going. I mean, because that's insane, right? Yes. Yes. Yes. I can sum it up I can sum it up in one phrase. ⁓ go to your room if you're gonna cry. Yep. Yep. That's it. Yes. Go away if you're gonna have emotions. Go to your room. You're I know you're four, but I need you to go to your room and handle your own shit. So if you're gonna cry, and I was a crybaby, that was my nickname. If you're gonna cry, go do it someplace else. Because I'm not gonna help you with it. So I tell people all the time, I can sum it up in one phrase. Go to your room and cry. If you're gonna cry, go to your room. Yeah. Yeah. You have to learn to cope on your own.

Yeah. You have to learn to cope on your own. One hundred percent. And it's or I would hear why it's kind of that whole be seen and not heard concept too. But I would also ⁓ I think a lot of us heard, ⁓ I'll give you if you're gonna cry, I'm gonna give you something to cry about. Which I never understood that. I'm already crying. But it's but it but it's so invalidating, right? 'Cause it's basically saying what you're crying about isn't worth crying about, but I can give you something which basically is threatening physical violence. Let's be real. So ⁓ Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Is not important. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. Absolutely. I have a quick question. Yeah. What is your family's background like like Irish or German or or Dutch or Mm-hmm. I'm Irish, mostly Irish. My sisters, my Dallas sister, Rhonda, It's weird to see yourself go from not even knowing your siblings because there's such a age gap to becoming really close to them in adulthood. It's something very special. ⁓ Okay. Cool. Just cool. But She bought me when twenty when 23andMe came out, she bought me a DNA test. She knows how important it is for me to know where I come from. And ⁓ it was ninety eight point nine percent Northern European, probably I think it was 70 something percent Irish, Scandinavian, all the things you would think looking at me, probably. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Swedish, Irish, yeah, yeah. Pretty much pretty much almost fully Irish though. And my sisters, ironically, were very similar. And that always made me feel good too. They had a little bit more of like a German and probably from their dad or something. They had a little bit more of ⁓ they were a little more pedigree than I was, but it that was a really cool experience. I would just stare at the DNA results. Like Right, right, right. cool. What a what a what a beautiful gift though. She she totally was seeing you by giving you that gift. Like knowing how much all that means to you. Like that's so cool. That's so cool. What I can what yeah, what prompted my question is Nicole's always gives me a problem or hard time. She's like your family doesn't talk. And your your family doesn't talk either. So I was curious if there's some How this is yeah. Yes, yes. Yep. Yep. Yeah, but even my family didn't talk. I think some of that I mean, your family will go on where they don't talk for years over s one thing that happened. I mean, it's just silent, right? Some things just don't have to be discussed. Now this what this this is unique should have been discussed. ⁓ that everyone's in on it. So that's totally unique. Well, I was gonna ask you maybe not, but for us, I think to jump ahead, 'cause I think we'll do jump ahead, jump back quite a bit here. But to jump ahead, when you found out, did your aunt Jackie talk to you about it at all? ⁓ Okay. About the prison or the ⁓ No. When you found out he wasn't your dad wasn't your bio dad. No one talked to me about it, except my sister. No. It was it was no Nancy, my Lubbock sister. I babysat her kids, my nieces, ⁓ we lived in the same town,

No one talked to me about it, except my sister. No. It was it was no Nancy, my Lubbock sister. I babysat her kids, my nieces, ⁓ we lived in the same town, So she didn't either. Okay, except your sister. And is it is it is is it Rhonda? Is that the sister? But as far my recollection is that no one talked about it. I will tell you my Lubbock sister, Nancy, apologized profusely and was so sad. Sorry. No, it's fine, of course. They couldn't tell me. She said, I wanted you so bad. I wanted you so bad. You had a right to know. She was like advocating for me finding out. She said, I want I there was a dozen times I almost told you because I didn't feel like it was fair. But I knew mom would, you know, not be happy about it. So she didn't, but she wanted so bad to tell me, and she's the only one. That apologized to me. You know, sh you you you bring bring up a really good point there. She was going through her own trauma from it because it was going against everything inside of her soul. And she loved you so much and felt protective of you. And then to have to keep that from you, that had to have been just destroying her as she's growing as she's, you know, going even though she was still young. I mean, she's older than you, but she's you're still you know, you look back now. You're still young in your twenties and in your teens. So ⁓ gosh, yes. yeah. Yep. Yes. Mm. Yes, yes. As much as there was that relief probably deep down inside that you finally knew that she could finally talk to you about it, that anguish, I'm sure, you know, and and so probably letting her have a chance to apologize to you was a gift to herself too. Like she needed to do that. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. mhm, mhm. ⁓ for sure. You know, my sisters had just as much trauma. They had a bio dad who was an alcoholic, another narcissist who pretty much wasn't a dad after the divorce. Money was his gift. ⁓ and they went through that divorce. Yeah. And then she marries Ed, my bio dad, and they went through that bullshit. And then they marry my dad. And for once, they have this stability in front of them that they've never had. They don't know they don't know about his history. They don't know that he's gonna screw up. They don't know all they know is they have money for the first time. They have, you know, a nice car in the driveway for the first time. They have a stepdad who apparently treated them wonderfully for the first time. And all of it is yanked away from them. Yep. So they had just as much ⁓ it's it's different trauma, but it's still just as impactful as the trauma I had. And I don't discount that. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. And you know, and during that time you had mentioned how your mom had some mental health issues. Do you think she had similar mental health issues as your grandmother? Mm-hmm. That's a good question. I think my mom's mental health issues came from stuffing everything inside of her instead of dealing with it. I I really do. That's why I I mean I'm open about my mental health. I am bipolar type two. I have socialized anxio anxiety disorder. I have ⁓ Probably on the sp I'm a little neurospicy, I think. But one pill took care of it. Like I'm on one little an anti-seizure medication and I've been fine for the last thirty years. So I feel like yes, and my mom struggled so much and with different medications and different so I have to believe hers was not a diagnosis like mine that can be That is so interesting. Wow.

That is so interesting. Wow. Fixed with a little pill. ⁓ bi bipolar is a little thing in your brain that fires wrong. It just fires wrong. And and an anti seizure medication calms that area of your brain. That's it. I mean, it's that simple. Yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. It yeah. Right. That's so fascinating. I never knew that. That is so fascinating. Wow. What but you don't think there's a chance? Because no one talked about mental health for her generation. You don't think there's a chance though? Maybe she had it and it was miss like never caught and she was just Could be. I mean, I look back at the the symptoms of her mental health and I don't see a pattern like I had. Bipolar one, you're real up. Like people will do reckless things, they'll make bad decisions, they'll and then they just crash into bed for the next four weeks. That's how bipolar type one works. That's why one of my psychiatrists said you're bipolar, fill out this little questionnaire. And I had Okay. Mm-hmm. Right. been on every antidepressant for 20 years. It didn't work. And there was a reason it didn't work, but no one ever delved into that. And she said, You're bipolar. And I said, No, I'm not. I know what bipolar is. There, you know, you're high, you're low. And she said, No, what you just described to me is type two bipolar all day. Life is great, life sucks. Life is great, life sucks. I can do this, no, you can't. I your brain is on a hamster wheel of mood. Worse. Up and down all day. It's not up and down here constantly. Okay. Okay. So it's like a roller coaster just so that so then that medicine leveled that out. Yes. All day. Yeah, it just stops that part of the brain that is causing that. It just silences it.

Okay. Okay. So it's like a roller coaster just so that so then that medicine leveled that out. Yes. All day. Yeah, it just stops that part of the brain that is causing that. It just silences it. That is amazing. That is amazing. I I've never first of all I've never heard of bipolar one and two. Yeah, me neither. I didn't know that existed. So the way you I always thought it was bipolar was one, how you describe one. Manic down. But with periods, right? A manic period. And then a down period. But then you're saying bipolar two is things are great, things aren't great, things are great, things aren't great. So I c so do you think you were Yeah, I know. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. All day. Was that right from the start? Like your whole life, your whole childhood? Were you having can you look back and think I was feeling this way through my elementary school years, my junior high years, my high school years? Was it like that? What I remember from those years is just intense anxiety. Like intense anxiety. I don't remember mood until it can be triggered by childbirth, pregnancy. It's most commonly diagnosed in ⁓ your 30s. And looking back, I believe it started late twenties, early thirties. Late twenties, yeah. Okay. Mm. Mm-hmm. Okay. Do you think you were ⁓ undiagnosed ADHD as a child? gosh, yes. You're lazy, you're not applying yourself, you're unfocused, settle down, pay attention in class, quit talking was the constant one. I didn't know I was ADHD until about six years ago. I knew I was, but I hadn't been a diagnosis. And my I went into my psychiatrist's office and it was a new, a new psychiatrist. I love. Hi, Michelle. And she Okay. Yes. Yeah.

Okay. Yes. Yeah. She's she's watching me. Of course, they're very they what you don't realize how much they observe you. So we're sitting there talking. I'm like, I can't, you know, I'm I'm having a hard time staying focused on stuff and I can't complete a task. It's very frustrating. I'll start one thing, blah, blah. And I'm not thinking ADHD. And she's watching me and she goes, Well, for one thing, you're ADHD. I was like, What? She goes, Look at you. She's like, Your your foot has not stopped moving since you got here. You're you're this is my emotional support lip bomb. I have to have something to do with my hands. Like she goes, you are you are blatantly ADHD. I said, no, because I'm I'm lazy. I'm not hyper. She goes, Gina, it's not hyperactivity in your body, it's hyperactivity in your brain. It's the first time I'd ever heard that. Your brain is hyperactive, not your body. Interesting. Okay. So when little boys they'd say, he's he's ADHD is hyperactive. Hyperactivity can can be a byproduct, but it is not that's not what it means. It means hyperactivity in the brain, not the body. Yes. is so but but almost like if your brain is hyperactive is the body following suit yes because I'm a big Mm-hmm. It causes your body. Yes. Yes. Your body doesn't know what to do with all that.

Yes. is so but but almost like if your brain is hyperactive is the body following suit yes because I'm a big Mm-hmm. It causes your body. Yes. Yes. Your body doesn't know what to do with all that. Right. So because it's almost like ⁓ they say the body the body keeps the score. There's a book and all that. But like for women, ⁓ a lot of us, me included, end up with autoimmune diseases because of being under constant trauma or constant stress or whatever. Right. So the body is going to ⁓ react even if you aren't like sure you can deny this or you can bury it, you can compartmentalize it, but your body's gonna deal with this. So that reminds me of your saying with ADHD, the brain is hyperactive. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Me too. Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And the body's gonna deal with it. So it's just kind of following suit, but it's Absolutely. Mm-hmm. not once the brain's leveled out, probably a lot of that physical ⁓ symptom of it calms, I would assume, right? Mm-hmm. Yes, I'm not near as ⁓ fidgety. I mean I if I'm doing something like this, or even sometimes if I'm making a video, I just like to have something to do with my hands. So I have my lip balm, which has become a fan favorite anyway. And ⁓ but I'm not like if I'm if I'm fidgety, it's most likely anxiety. It's probably not my ADHD. Mm-hmm. Mm. Mm-hmm. Right. It's most likely just anxiety. Because I'm Excuse me. Okay, that makes sense. a highly anxious person. So that's probably what it is.

Mm-hmm. Mm. Mm-hmm. Right. It's most likely just anxiety. Because I'm Excuse me. Okay, that makes sense. a highly anxious person. So that's probably what it is. And you remember being anxious from your earliest memory what you can remember from your child because a lot of people who've suffered trauma don't remember their childhood. Like you can't like I know like Brian can tell me things. Yeah, same. Brian can tell me things from when he was eight and my stories are all trauma. Like I remember what I remember are the trauma parts and then I'll randomly be like, there was a basketball game in there. Yes. gosh, ⁓ I don't remember. Mm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm, Or I remember having a sleepover, but I can't mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. tell you much about my childhood except for those traumatic parts. And I I didn't know that was a sign of childhood trauma. Are you in the same boat though? You're almost saying you don't remember even some of the trauma. Right. Yes. I remember the conver the not conversation, but I remember sitting in my mom's bed and her telling me that they were getting divorced. I remember that. I don't remember him leaving. I don't ever remember him being in the home. I was told that I was a big daddy's girl. No memory of that. The only memory I do have of him so funny is sitting in his lap in a ch in a recliner, and I thought it was at my house that I grew up in, and maybe it was. They may have Right. got in that house right before he went off to prison. But I remember sitting in his lap, playing with his chest hair. I was probably three or four. And eating eating buttermilk and cornbread out of a cup with him. I remember that. Isn't that weird? That's all I remember. Yeah.

Yeah. Now w when he went when he went to prison, ⁓ did you guys lose the house? Like did your whole lifestyle have to change? No, my grandfather, my mom's dad helped her. Helped her. He gave her, you know, back then, two hundred dollars a month. That's your house payment. So he gave her, I think he gave her two hundred dollars a month, which paid her house payment and probably electricity. I remember her getting upset when her house payment went up to two sixty five. Okay. Right. That's amazing. I can't even imagine. That's amazing. my gosh. That's crazy. Well, I mean, so that's that's a positive. Mm-hmm. I know. I know. We're talking Yeah. We're talking about a three bedroom, two thousand square foot house. We're not talking about a shack. Isn't that crazy? I just that blows my mind. Wow. Jeez. That is crazy. But that was like what early seventies? 'Cause I'm thinking you're seven. You're born in sixty six, so early seven. Yeah, so ⁓ yeah. So okay, I know the farm was like a a safe place for you. Good memories. When you were in school, was school was there anything about elementary school or middle school, junior high? I'm not sure what you called it. but that time Mm-hmm. Yep. Yep. Early seventies. Yeah. Where whether it was through sports or clubs or art or theater or a teacher or academics, did anything else help balance out what was going on at home, it in school or was that just as traumatic?

Where whether it was through sports or clubs or art or theater or a teacher or academics, did anything else help balance out what was going on at home, it in school or was that just as traumatic? Not school. ⁓ I was teased horribly ⁓ about being too skinny. I was called, you know, to ⁓ tapeworm, totem pole, skinny bones, you know, all the things. And so say school was not a safe place for me until high school when I just became the class clown and And I but I was never I never had the self-confidence to join any groups, any clubs, become I'm not if you've ever seen me run, you would never ask me if I played sports. People are like, you're so tall. I bet you played basketball or volleyball. I'm like, girl, no. So no. But I never had the self-confidence to always wanted to be in theater. Shocking, right? ⁓ and I didn't have the I didn't have the self-confidence to do anything like that. Okay. Mm-hmm. So I wasn't popular in high school. I was just the tall, skinny, funny girl, you know. are you? Bob Chan. Okay, so you're well it Yeah, that's not like crazy tall. Like you mean it's tall, but it's not you're not like six two, six three. People assume if you're over five seven you played sports. I think that's the it's gotta be. Uh-huh. Yeah, yeah. But If you're a girl. Interesting. That's that's well, did you have a at least one or two best friends or a social circle to lean on during those years?

If you're a girl. Interesting. That's that's well, did you have a at least one or two best friends or a social circle to lean on during those years? Okay, so this brings us to brandy. Okay, when I was Nine, she moved in two doors down from me in Lubbock. And one day, my brother-in-law tells it the story best because he was there. she just comes to my front door, four years old. No parent with her, nothing. ⁓ so she comes to my front door, she knocks on the door and she goes, Hi, my name is Blandy. Do you have any kids here? And so my brother-in-law is like, ⁓ yeah, we've got a little girl here. She's seven or eight, whatever, eight or nine, whatever it was. And I come out and I'm like, what would I do playing with a four-year-old? Well, then I realized this is the little sister I never had. And it has been one of the best relationships of my life. I feel like Brandy was my sister. ⁓ we call her the fifth sister. and she would do anything I told her to. We would play anything I wanted to. It was like having this little because she at that age she admired me. I was older. And then as as we as we got older and the shift came to spring break, woohoo. Yeah, of course. It was she was my caregiver. She was my the roles were complete role reversal. She'll she'll still say stuff about try to keep her under control, you know, so she became like the parent. But Brandy is my oldest and dearest friends. We're going on ⁓ 50 years, 50 no, yeah, like 53 years or something like that. Right.

Right. 54 years. She's yes, she still lives in Lubbock. So and she's married. And ⁓ she lives every time I go to Lubbock to see family, you know. Of course I see Brandy. She just comes over like the, you know, she's a family member. She's definitely a family member. I was her maid of honor. Yeah. She got married. She got married pretty recently. She was unmarried till she was almost 50, or maybe she was 50. And That's amazing. That is so rare. That's amazing. ⁓ That's cool. found her Prince charming and so I was she was my maid of honor and I was hers and ⁓ we have that just that we can go months without speaking. And when we do, it's just like no time has gone by, you know. So yes. Those are my favorite friendships. Those are my favorite friendships. I have a couple of friends like that where we could go six months without speaking. And when we do, it's like we were just talking to each other. And I tell my my daughter especially, I'm like, 'cause she's starting she's twenty five and she's starting to now have a friend or two like that. And I'm like, those are the best friendships. Because it stands the test of time. You know that that woman is gonna be in your life going forward. And it's such a forever. yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Forever. Mm-hmm. Such a wonderful feeling. It's one of the reasons Yes. Yes. I really love ⁓ the voice memo option on the phone because I'll just talk and send her like 15 minutes of just updates and just send it off. And then a couple days later I'll get a voice memo. I love that. It's a great way to stay in touch. So okay. So were you were you and Brandy ever in school together or did you always just get out when she would be starting? It sounds like.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, we were never in school together. So in fifth grade, ⁓ I had A new best friend, Natalie, whose birthday is today. 60th birthday. Happy birthday, Natalie. She she and I were attached at the hip at school, ⁓ after school. I was her safe place apparently. My house was. There was a lot going on at her house that I didn't know about. And ⁓ happy birthday, Natalie. Wow. ⁓ You know, we'd spend the night with each other mostly at my house, her safe space. And then Brandy was my all the time friend, but Natalie and I were the best, we were school friends. And you know, we grew up, we grew apart in adulthood. She moved off. We lived in the dorm together our first year in college. And whoo, boy, was that a lot of fun. Holy smoke. I'm surprised. I'm surprised I survived because I came out of high school green as the grass. Okay. Mm-hmm. Never drank, never went to parties, never none of that. And then moved in with Natalie. Yeah. I was I was not the typical Gen X high schooler, that's for sure. I dated my ex husband all through high school. And we didn't we just hung out with each other. Wow, okay. Okay, so so when did you was he your first boyfriend? serious boyfriend, yeah. Yeah. And we were juniors, I think. Yeah, we were juniors in high school. And when did when Okay. So you you guys start dating and then it's pretty much you two. And w was he Mm-hmm. Yeah. And we weren't in the party group, you know. Okay. Was he simil did he have s any similar characteristics to your dad? Or was he the opposite?

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And we weren't in the party group, you know. Okay. Was he simil did he have s any similar characteristics to your dad? Or was he the opposite? ⁓ now Chris was He was spoiled. Like his parents spoiled him, but he was a good guy. ⁓ he's now he has, you know, some issues and stuff, but back then he was a good boyfriend. He was a really good boyfriend. He's the father of my two older children. So probably when you met him or you ⁓ started dating him, he was became another safe space for you, I would assume, because was that the first real male figure in your life in so long at least that was stable and consistent and there for you? Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-mm. My and that wasn't even close to my well, I mean, my Papa Cecil, when I tell you I was closer to him than any of the others, doesn't mean we were that close. We didn't have it like in conversations. And he just was really sweet and he took care of my mom. And that was, you know, his step he didn't have any children of his own. And so he really dug his teeth into my mom and her sister as his children. So, but Chris was Or besides your grandfather maybe? Yeah. Yeah. Probably and his family. He had ⁓ he has a he has a great family. His mother was always good to me, his father was always good to me. ⁓ but they're again, they're a family that doesn't talk about important things. And so there were some issues there ⁓ with his behavior with things they didn't know was going were going on and you just don't talk about stuff like that. So ⁓ but he probably you're probably r you know, you're probably right. He probably was. I think. Yeah. Well I mean A stable male fee. I'd never thought about it like that.

I think. Yeah. Well I mean A stable male fee. I'd never thought about it like that. Well, I think it would make sense. I mean, all of us I okay, so speaking for myself, my high school boyfriend was like that first 'cause I had abandonment issues. So he was that first consistent and we very much became together, right? Like we were so social. And high school couples in general get very obsessed with each other and all that and they're spending all their time together. But you had those couples that were able to still assimilate and be with the group every weekend, and then those couples that were more like just us. And so and sometimes I wonder. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. you know, like for you, that kind of makes sense because there's this stability and ⁓ so it makes sense that it kind of would just be the two of you during those years and maybe you wouldn't you maybe didn't even have a desire to be out there with everyone because you know, also your social anxiety might have been playing in there too without you even realizing it. Well, I don't know that I had a lot of social anxiety back then. I will say my ⁓ Chris was a drummer, very, very talented drummer. And he played like five in he plays like five instruments by ear. Like he doesn't even read music. So he was in jazz band and stuff like that. But he was a drummer in bands. So we were always Wow. going to see his gigs as we got older. When we got older, when we turned 21, that's we were, you know, I was at his gigs every weekend and he had really good bands. And so I became real social for that. I I'm not sure. I think my social anxiety, Nicole, is more not social in the aspect of going out and having fun with friends. It's more Right.

Right. Being in a cla in a in a auditorium classroom at school, at college, and not knowing anyone, and then I have this, you know, my insecurities feeling like everyone's looking at me or talking about me or thinking this about me, or I think when I say social anxiety, I think it means more of a social environment, but not necessarily out seeing a band. If that makes sense. Okay. That makes sense. Now, d do you get anxiety about the idea of having to talk talk to people? Yes. ⁓ not anymore. Okay. Did so so the the concept of being around people and having c and and talking to them, having conversations, that doesn't cause you anxiety. But it's more being in a dropped into a situation you maybe feel you don't know anything about and feeling the insecurities. Like almost like an imposter syndrome anxiety. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. But I'm not really like that anymore. ⁓ I don't see myself that way anymore. I don't see I see myself very open and I I'm a I'm a really good counselor for my friends and I, you know, I think my youngest daughter feels like I'm too much of a counselor. I don't know if that makes sense. maybe not enough of a mom and too much of a counselor, but ⁓ I'm a good ear. People come to me for advice and for, you know, that kind of stuff. So I feel like I have a very open demeanor. And you could drop me in a room with people that want to have intellectual conversation and I would be fine. Drop me in a room where like I'm going to see the Gen X take over Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. sh comedy show when they come to Dallas in September. I haven't met any of them. I'm super excited about that. But like being dropped in that environment and and being told, hey, you know, Gen X Gina here, stand up and wave, I would be a little bit like because the it's been difficult for me having fans and stuff. I don't understand it. If does that make sense? Like if that Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they're awesome. Absolutely. Yes. Yeah because I'm just a you know, I see myself differently than I think people see me, maybe. I don't know. I think I think that's kind of an imposter syndrome thing. Almost like, do I deserve this adoration? Or I just deserve the it's it's that and that's that imposter syndrome. and it's funny because we've had dad bod on, we've had the professor, and we've had Sherri on, ⁓ the Real Slim Sherri for listeners who may not know, and they all kind of touched on that too a little bit. And but one thing that I think is Mm-hmm. Yes, yes, yes. Yes. Mm-hmm. a way to look at it is what you're giving them, that's you're giving them a space to kind of escape whatever's going on in their daily life. and you're also seeing them and validating. Cause for Gen X especially, no one saw us, no one talked to us. We were pretty much ignored, forgotten. And it's almost like now where especially with social media, we're all able to like say, my God, you had that happen too. You had that happen too. You feel that way too. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm. We didn't know we were having a shared experience when we were having it. We thought we were the only one. And not knowing no, we all were going through it. And so now what you do is is you're sharing that and helping people feel validated through what you're doing. And so when they're coming to you with that adoration, it's almost ⁓ it's not it is about you, but it's almost about the way you make them feel more than you. Does that make sense? Right. Right. Yes. Mm-hmm. Yeah, yes. And I get comments all the time, ⁓ especially from women that are like, I've been going through this, I've been going through cancer treatment, or I've been going through a divorce, or I've been going through this, and I can't tell you how much joy you have brought me and how I mean, I have had one lady tell me I saved her life. That that kind of stuff is like, whoa, that's a lot of responsibility. It it it makes me feel I it is a it's a worthiness thing. I think I think you're right. It's a worthiness thing. Do I I view myself as just a girl having fun on the internet and I was telling my sister, and I think this this is true for probably a lot of people, when I edit my videos and I'm look and I'm watching myself. Yeah, right. Yeah. That's not me. That's her. Okay. So I'll be like, gosh, she's funny. She she's really funny and that I well that's me. Or it it there's this disconnect. There's a disconnect of of viewing myself as someone else online.

It's interesting 'cause Yeah, it's reconciling that that is you and that is that imposter syndrome and that worthiness of like she's funny, but it's also then moving into I'm funny, I'm funny, I'm worthy of what's happening because I'm producing it's coming from inside of me. But in order for you to probably I think that's so Gen Xo, but in order for you to process it, it's she's funny because you just it's just so hard. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes. 'Cause we weren't raised to like be proud of ourselves or you know, we do it with our kids, like everything they do. That's amazing. No one, you know, no one did that. No one built us up and so it's it's uncomfortable. It's uncomfortable. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. A that's a perfect way to describe it. It's ⁓ it causes me a little bit of discomfort. Now I'm getting better about it. My sister has really helped me with that. my Dallas Rhonda, she's really helped me with that. ⁓ accepting the fame attached to what I'm doing. People now recognize me in public. I walked into a casino in Oklahoma and the girl at the door was like, my God, I follow you on Facebook. And then the friend I was with, her coworker came up and was like, You're Gen X Gina You know, it's happening. I walked in to get my nails done the other day. And the lady was in there and she goes, my gosh, I follow you on Instagram. I was like, so that's it almost makes me there's like a joy to it, but then Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. The joy gets capped with the uncertainty of the worthiness, if that makes sense. It's it's a it's a really interesting dichotomy because at first I'm like, I got recognized. And then it just starts coming down as well, what if who says they even like your content? Maybe they don't even like your content. They just recognize you. The doubt. You know. Mm-hmm. Yep. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yes, the self-doubt. And I wonder how much of it is ⁓ I don't know. I always grew up waiting for the other shoe to drop. Like even with something was good, I'm like something's gonna go bad. And I almost would like ⁓ fixate on what all the things that could go bad to make sure I'm prepared for when it does. You know, and ⁓ and I'm a big believer in thoughts, create your reality. All that I think I already said that so, but ⁓ so I've worked hard the last especially five years to not let my y I'll ⁓ yes. Mm-hmm. yes. Mm-hmm. thoughts go in that direction and to try to be present and really enjoy whatever is happening in front of me. But I can't imagine getting recognized and having that energy, that's a lot of energy being thrown at you that you kind of have to process in that moment. It's not like you can be like, hold on a second. I need to give me a minute. You need to be able to have a reaction back and process that. And I'm sure, I'm sure that goes on for like a day or two after if you have a lot of people come at you, you probably have to process it, I would assume.

Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I was recognized at work yesterday and that was uncomfortable. I don't want to be recognized at work. I don't want people to be able to find me. I don't want, ⁓ I don't even share what I do for a living specifically. So to be recognized at work was a little ⁓ frightening, to be honest, a little ⁓ scary. And he was very nice. He he said, ⁓ my gosh, he goes, You know. Right. I love your content. I follow you on Facebook. I was like, thank you. But then I wanted to get out of there. I want I and actually should have probably told him, hey, don't, you know, don't mention anything about meeting me here or, you know, and the next time I see him, he's a he's a he's regular there. I think I will ⁓ say something to him, like, you know, I don't really want pe and I'm sure maybe he wouldn't, but there's that doubt of Yeah. What if he tells so and so and then everyone finds out where I work, you know, that kind of thing. So Yeah, it's it's probably put figuring out how to keep those boundaries up. And there's and probably that hesitancy, as much as it's that joy of, they recognize me, but also that protection protectiveness about yourself. Like, I only want to expose so much of myself. You know, and and in real life, you have to be careful of almost it's almost premeditating. It's almost probably like a script you have to create for yourself. Like when I run into a fan. Mm-hmm. Yes. Yes. These are the things how I'm gonna react. And then it's gonna stop here. So that you don't inadvertently expose more of yourself than what you want. I don't know if that makes sense.

These are the things how I'm gonna react. And then it's gonna stop here. So that you don't inadvertently expose more of yourself than what you want. I don't know if that makes sense. Mm-hmm. Because I'm I'm ⁓ I do give away too much. Like ⁓ I cr I created a group on Facebook. It's called ⁓ Gen X DFW Locals. So it's Dallas Fort Worth. I need to change the name because I have people from Timbuktu trying to join. I'm like DFW means Dallas Fort Worth. But anyway, we've had two meetups. So I'm actually creating a group, creating a community within my Mm-hmm. surroundings and bringing people together, my followers get to come hang out with me, building community. And that has been really cathartic for me accepting the Right. I don't want to say fame because that that that's not that's a stronger word than I'm seeking. The recognition or the recognition, like these people want to come hang out with me. So I think that's helping kind of accept that you're a public figure now. And you gotta find ways to to cope with that. You put yourself out there and now figure out how to handle it, you know, that kind of thing. The adoration, the recognition. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and the th the way with social media is that it could grow so quickly qu faster than ⁓ you even can start to think how you're gonna handle it. Like your fame could be superseding, you could be catching up. Like, hold on a minute, I gotta figure out how to handle this. I think that ⁓ meetup is great. It's almost like a baby step in a way, you know, because yeah, 'cause I know you have ⁓ Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes. Yeah. And we'll get there once we I wanna I'll I'll bring that up, but go ahead. Or just a thought on this. Yeah. Do you think it's imposter syndrome or more like I don't know how the hell make sense of this? It doesn't make sense that all these people wanna be around me. There's slight difference there, I think. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it doesn't make sense. It it it doesn't make sense. It just doesn't make sense to me. Like it I'm just Gina. Like, I don't it doesn't make sense to me. That's a great way to put it, Brian, because that's kind of what I'm seeking. The a way to explain it. It doesn't make any sense to me. I'm a boring homebody dog mom who just has social life when I want one who doesn't want a relationship, doesn't want to put forth that effort, just I I don't see anything To be admired. And that sounds so awful. But except for my online persona. And I'm not saying I'm not me online. I'm just a really funnier sarcastic version of me, but I'm still me. I still tell my story. I still tell stories. I still am open. There's probably not a question you could ask me that I wouldn't answer, except the things we've discussed. There's probably just nothing about my childhood. I truly believe. Every single person has a story to tell and they have every right to tell it, even if they just tell it, even if they're comfortable telling it to one person. I've had people, I my my my story has that video has started circling again. You know, have I just kind of every once in a while you have a a video of yours start pumping out views again. And I've had people say, Thank you so much for sharing your story. Yeah.

Yeah. Because it makes me feel better about my story. And every time in every comment I write, you have a right to tell your story. It's yours. Do with it what you want to. Yeah. Kind of goes into what you were talking about. It maybe isn't a it's a reflection of how you make people feel, how they respond. She's validating. You're validating them by acknowledging, hey, you have a right to tell your story and I'm an open book with mine. And well, I think also seeing ⁓ Gen Xers, especially Gen X women doing this inspires other Gen X women. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. to find the courage to even like you just said, even tell their story to one person. Because so many of us were quiet, compartmentalized, grinded through. So it's almost like having peers put themselves out there, then it kind of emboldens us to say, okay, well I can tell I can talk a little bit too. Let me tell someone about what I went through or sh she went through that. So I'm not weird because someone else went through it. So okay, maybe I can talk about it. Mm-hmm. And that then you really get down to y you're helping people on a healing journey if you really think about it. Though and that is powerful stuff. Yes. Yes. And And that's a comfortable place for me. That's a comfortable place for me because I am by nature a counselor. That's what my degree's in. I I'm by nature someone who wants to help others handle their shit. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes is it deflection? Sometimes is it deflection? Has it been deflection in the past to not handle my own shit? Probably. Probably. But now I've accepted my past. I've accepted who I am. If you don't like me this way, you don't have to. You don't have to like me. I don't need you to like me anymore. I needed people to like me in the past. I don't need that anymore. So when people, you're just online to get attention. But no, I'm online because my dream was to be on Saturday Night Live and be funny. Like, I get so sick of looking at my damn face when I'm editing. I'm like, my God, this isn't this isn't like an attention-seeking mission. This is a getting to live a very small dream by entertaining audience, which is what I told I told Sherri in a comment the other day, I said, ⁓ You guys up on stage doing this, you are living my dream and thank you for letting me live vicariously through you. Because, you know. Yeah. I think it's I think ⁓ right now is when so many Gen Xers are finally deciding, okay, I'm gonna go for my dream because if I don't now, when? And so seeing, like I said, seeing Gen X peers out there doing that just gives the rest of us courage to you know, and and it's funny because ⁓ I think what you're doing is through the validation. Mm-hmm. Right. Mm-hmm. and ⁓ resonating with people and helping them feel seen, I really do think it is healing. And so that is where you can find some sense in it. Is that's what you're comfortable with, is helping people heal. And ⁓ that's kind of what you're doing there because by that little part of s everyone, maybe it just triggered them to just talk to one person about one thing that happened to them. Mm-hmm. Yes.

Mm-hmm. Yes. And that's the first step in it all. So that's that's it's all it's all in humor, but yeah. You need to, you've got to, yes, you have to remove the shame. Your story isn't all your fault. You shouldn't have shame because shame is destructive. Shame will destroy your your self-worth. It will destroy your self-confidence. And by telling your story openly, honestly, forthcoming, not leaving anything out. Yes. You are removing the shame that you had attached to your story. I don't have any shame attached to any part of my story anymore because I've gotten it out there. That's why I say if you have a story, tell it even to one person, even to a friend that you've never told or a coworker, anyone that you feel safe with that that you know isn't going to go spread. You know, if you're worried about them talking to other people or something, someone you feel safe with, get it out. And I promise you, the first time I told my story about my mom, my about my dad being in prison, it was the hardest thing I'd ever done. I was shameful. Why? I'm not the one who did what he did. And and I will say, I'm gonna back up just a minute. When my mom said, when I we haven't told that part of the story yet, but my mom said, I knew that I was doing the right thing because if I'd have told you at seven years old that your dad went to prison, you would have told little Sally at school, who would have told little Jessica, who would have told little Billy. And she's right. She was protecting me. So the anger I had attached to the secrets and to the lies. I would have done the same thing she did. But I would have told me later without me having to find out. And that's another story how I found out. But but she her not telling me in the beginning, I appreciate now because if everyone had found out, I would have been ridiculed, I would have been teased, I would have been d you know, nicknamed. And so I I appreciate that from her now. There's a lot of things I appreciate about my mom now.

Right. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. No, it makes that makes perfect sense. And I think you're right. I think I think all of us would have done that. Like I don't think we would have told our seven year old your dad's gone to prison. I think we would have figured out now maybe we all would have done it in a different way, but it's still differently. But I think I love what you said though about the shame of our story is not ours to carry, basically. And and I it's realizing that is that it has it's not ours. Differently. Mm-hmm. Mm. It's okay to talk about these things. It happened it it it happened to us, not by us. So you can't why carry shame something that happened to you that wasn't you didn't do it. So you shouldn't have any shame attached. And I had shame ⁓ forever. Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. It's amazing. Such a powerful message from a woman to another woman, right? Because the whole Me Too has been a lot about shame when they were victimized. And what you're just what you're saying is so empowering, I think, for for people to hear that. It's really great. It's it and there and that's what it is. Like through what you do online, through the humor, the sarcasm, all the stuff, that comes through, right? So you're reaching people with your own vehicle, your own way to do it. Yes. Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yes. Mm-hmm. Yes. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But it's making a difference. It's impacting lives. And there's the sense of it. And then that's why there's the adoration, because you you had an effect on their life, even if it's small. Well, humor's the ultimate icebreaker too. Well breaks the ice, gets the barriers down, and now you can enter and and Gen X is fluent in sarcasm. So we all we all get that. So to go back, okay. I do have a question. Okay. When did you first tell your story? And was it very liberating? Were you like, ⁓ I got this off my Yes. ⁓ Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm. You're not gonna believe this, but the first time I told my full story was online. And it was it was obviously the shorter version. I have 90 seconds, right? It was written with me in the background because ⁓ a a follower, or I don't know if they were a follower, but commented, made a comment that said, Wow, it must be nice to have no you look like someone. Right. ch that has no childhood trauma must be nice. I look like what do you what does a childhood trauma person look like? So I did a response video and put out it basically ⁓ when I was seven my dad disappeared. I was told, you know, the the bullet points of my story and put it out there for the whole world to see. And it was like Wow. Mm. Yeah.

Wow. Mm. Yeah. A ton of bricks got lifted off of me. I had friends that never heard it. I had family that had never heard it. I put it out for the whole world to see, thinking if I can help one person that has that can relate to this, if I can help one person, it was totally worth it. And you should have seen the comments. I was bawling like a baby. my God, your story is so similar to mine. Your story made me realize this or do this or and I knew right then after exhaling that I just put this out there for the world to see. I knew after reading the comments that I had done the right thing. And was it the right thing for me at the time? It felt like it, but was it the right thing to do for others at the time? Absolutely. Because I feel like it it helped unburden people. And I had one lady come up later And say ⁓ her comment, she said, because of your story, I went and talked to my uncle about blah blah blah. And I got I was brave enough to do this. So thank you. Comments like that are the best comments because you know you're making a difference. Just and and also it can be on the other side of the spectrum where you're where you get, my gosh, I I get my coffee in the morning and I open up to see what Mm-hmm. video you posted and you get my day going. Those are just as impactful, but knowing that you've reached someone, you've reached someone on the level of bravery to do something is a whole different ballgame. So those are those are powerful.

Absolutely. So yeah, you didn't even sit down to tell your story. It was like you're responding to someone semi-snarky comment and you're like, ⁓ no, let me set the record straight. At seven this happened. Yeah, interesting. Was that ⁓ at the beginning of your content creator ⁓ career or was that more when things had really were height get taking off? Yes. Yep. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I did it twice. I did ⁓ because I didn't have access to the other video that I had done. I didn't even know where it was. ⁓ I did it twice. On TikTok, when I was still just on TikTok, I think I did it. Maybe I posted on Facebook. It took me a long time to get going